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Old 10-28-2005, 10:46 PM   #1
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how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

so lets say i wanted to run 93 for the track. basically any lil thing i can do i'm gonna do to help my times. not sure what tech section this belongs to so ya.

what i wanted to know is if i put 93 fuel in on an empty tank tomorrow morning, will my computer adjust itself to it throughout the day?
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Old 10-28-2005, 10:48 PM   #2
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

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Originally Posted by tedness
so lets say i wanted to run 93 for the track. basically any lil thing i can do i'm gonna do to help my times. not sure what tech section this belongs to so ya.

what i wanted to know is if i put 93 fuel in on an empty tank tomorrow morning, will my computer adjust itself to it throughout the day?
Do you have a chip burned for 93?

If not then don't waste your money on 93 because it won't make a difference.
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Old 10-28-2005, 10:52 PM   #3
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

no chip.

alright, then ill just mah 97 crappo.
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Old 10-28-2005, 10:56 PM   #4
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

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no chip.

alright, then ill just mah 97 crappo.
87 you mean?
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:02 PM   #5
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

I didn't think the car had to adjust itself to accept higher octane. When i use 100 octane i feel it right away. I also have a good tune when i do that too so it's not a waste.

here's some cool info on racing fuel and how to mix the chemicals yourself.

http://www.turbofast.com.au/racefuel.html
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:22 PM   #6
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

Actually...the way our computers work is they are constantly pushing the engine to the knocking point, and backing it off slightly. So technically...it will make a small difference running 93
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:24 PM   #7
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

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Originally Posted by lowflyn
Actually...the way our computers work is they are constantly pushing the engine to the knocking point, and backing it off slightly. So technically...it will make a small difference running 93
Can you back that up?
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:25 PM   #8
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

How do you want me to back it up? Technical info or actual articles.
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:26 PM   #9
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

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Originally Posted by lowflyn
How do you want me to back it up? Technical info or actual articles.
Information supporting it in anyway?

I am not doubting you I just want to know more....
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:27 PM   #10
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

Well, I'll put it this way, my roommate, a car builder says so. And my friend chris, who has written 2 computers for cars says so lol. It makes sense though. But to be honest, it won't make a big enough difference to do anything.
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:29 PM   #11
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

I've wondered about that too...I've heard it both ways, but I've never realy heard a "This is why...".
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:50 PM   #12
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

I think for regular street driving it would be a waste to fill up your tank with 93. But if you're at the track and trying to get every tenth of a second then i could see it being justified. especially if its just a couple gallons. I know from my personal experience when i used a mix of 100 and crap 87 before i had my predator tuner i could sense a smoother acceleration. (not just something in my head) It wouldn't make much of a difference for regular street driving but at the track it definitely can't hurt.
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:53 PM   #13
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

I never bothered putting 93 in until I got my SCT tuner, so I don't really have anything to compare a before and after to. I did notice it made a difference when I did it with the tuner, but as far as before that, I don't have anything to compare. I would think it would have to make some difference tho, because higher octane fuel burns hotter and more efficiently, so even if the computer doesn't recognize it, I'd think it would still do something unless the computer retards it or something.
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Old 10-28-2005, 11:57 PM   #14
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

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Originally Posted by DarkShadow
I would think it would have to make some difference tho, because higher octane fuel burns hotter and more efficiently, so even if the computer doesn't recognize it, I'd think it would still do something unless the computer retards it or something.
The computer burns the fuel the comuter tells it too. If your timing is not advanced it will continue to burn at the same tempature regardless of 87 or 93 hince you getting nothing out of the 93.

Just a waste of a money without your timing advanced.
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Old 10-29-2005, 12:01 AM   #15
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

So the computer does essentialy ****** it?
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Old 10-29-2005, 12:18 AM   #16
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

The difference in burning 87 to 93 is only measurable in instrumentation and will not show up as a gain. The computer adjust to different octane only make minute changes to the oxygen level reading it receives and the knock sensor moving timing around.

So putting higher octane gas in a stock stang for performance gains is as effective as putting spinners on your car.
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Old 10-29-2005, 12:28 AM   #17
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

wow. i guess i need a chip w/ adjustable tunes for 87 and 93. one for track, one for street.
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Old 10-29-2005, 02:22 AM   #18
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lowflyn
Actually...the way our computers work is they are constantly pushing the engine to the knocking point, and backing it off slightly. So technically...it will make a small difference running 93
i doubt that.

at WOT the ecu uses a pre programmed fuel and timing map. it only has to think if it detects knock. as for other driving, it may be different, using inputs from the maf, o2 sensors, throttle input, load, and rpm to extrapolate a fuel ratio and timing advance for that moment in time. the knock sensor only sends a signal when it detects knock, meaning the computer only sees it when it is picking up knock, unlike other sensors that are constantly sending data back and forth(as in, the ones the ecu relies on), which means the ecu doesnt rely on the knock sensor to create a fuel/spark table.

unless you are running a other than stock tune, running higher octane fuel would make no difference.

unless were talking boosted vehicles, then running higher octanes allows for higher boost levels with a higher margin for tune error(or closer to the edge tune) due to the higher octanes level of fuel being able to ward off knock and predetonation. i tried to run 100 octane as much as possible on the dsm, but the station that sold it was a 20 min drive out of town, and i only got 100 octane when i was out at that city anyways for business.
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Old 10-29-2005, 09:00 AM   #19
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

run the cheap crap there is no difference in your vehcile, some people are just retarded.
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Old 10-29-2005, 01:37 PM   #20
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

and if there is a difference it will be so small it wont be worth the extra few cents.
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Old 10-29-2005, 01:44 PM   #21
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

Actually about 5 or 6 years ago the DOT and Gov regulators forced the Gasoline industry to remove any advertisements or suggestions saying that using medium or high grade gas is beneficial in any way to a car design to run on regular. It is a scientific fact OIL COMPANIES LIE!!! Just look at them lying now.
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Old 10-29-2005, 03:37 PM   #22
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

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It is a scientific fact OIL COMPANIES LIE!!! Just look at them lying now.
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Old 10-29-2005, 09:15 PM   #23
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

It helps my car....lol. Actually..my car knocks pretty dang bad with 87 in it and the chip. Not doing that one again.
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Old 10-29-2005, 09:23 PM   #24
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

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Originally Posted by lowflyn
It helps my car....lol. Actually..my car knocks pretty dang bad with 87 in it and the chip. Not doing that one again.
Only because the 87 in your town was not really 87. In another words the gas in your area suxs!!!!!!

Next!!!
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Old 10-29-2005, 09:32 PM   #25
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

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Only because the 87 in your town was not really 87. In another words the gas in your area suxs!!!!!!

Next!!!
He is saying it knocks bad because he has a chip (if he uses 87)
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Old 10-29-2005, 09:39 PM   #26
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

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He is saying it knocks bad because he has a chip (if he uses 87)
Well he is a knuckle head at the very least for confusing me BY GOD
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Old 10-29-2005, 09:40 PM   #27
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

Haha, that was my whole point corey, to confuse you. But yeh...my mom put 87 in it at one point with the chip...it really really didn't like it. Thankfully she didn't put much in and I added about 8 gallons of 93 and it cleared up.
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Old 10-30-2005, 12:18 AM   #28
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

mmm...gas...

trackday imminent...running full interior etc. glee.

haha i want to get outta the 16's
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Old 10-30-2005, 04:17 PM   #29
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

i know with fuel the higher the grade the hotter it burns hotter is better but you have to have a nice spark there for it to be any help at all unless your running 100 or higher but most fuel injected cars cant handle it
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Old 10-31-2005, 07:03 AM   #30
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Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

Higher octane does not burn hotter or faster, It Is just more resistant to knock.
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Old 11-02-2005, 02:52 PM   #31
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Talking Re: how long for engine to learn new fuel type?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent
The computer burns the fuel the comuter tells it too. If your timing is not advanced it will continue to burn at the same tempature regardless of 87 or 93 hince you getting nothing out of the 93.

Just a waste of a money without your timing advanced.


Premium gas burns more slowly than regular gas. That's why you need it in higher compression engines to reduce pinging.

I doubt that you could detect any difference in temperature between regular and premium gas.


All best,
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