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Old 11-01-2005, 08:35 PM   #36
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiljosh
Wait, your a guy. Right? So howto donkeypunch.
I don't want to know but I'll just bet it can be done.
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Old 11-01-2005, 08:51 PM   #37
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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Originally Posted by DarkShadow
1. Very true.
2. Who is he?
3. I hope so.
4. Um...er...yes. Andy said really the only important one is the boost gauge. I was gonna get a fuel pressure but he said once it's tuned that's really irrelevant unless you just really like to monitor that sort of thing. And I think it's PRETTY!
2: Brent Delk @ www.delkperformance.com

3: ok . but i know of one thats 100% accurate and makes purdy colors too.
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Old 11-01-2005, 08:53 PM   #38
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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Originally Posted by white95v6
2: Brent Delk @ www.delkperformance.com

3: ok . but i know of one thats 100% accurate and makes purdy colors too.
Holy crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How come nobody Knew aboout this place!!!!!!!!!!
Tell me absolutely everything because if they have an actual mustang dyno that's what I'm going to do!
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Old 11-01-2005, 08:57 PM   #39
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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Originally Posted by DarkShadow
Holy crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How come nobody Knew aboout this place!!!!!!!!!!
Tell me absolutely everything because if they have an actual mustang dyno that's what I'm going to do!

lmao. alot of ppl Know about it. if they know of my car they should Know about Delk Performance. they have tuned the worlds fastest V6.

and yes they have a Mustang Dyno. that is the dyno that i have used for all of my Dyno #s. from way back when i was a almost bone stock 3.8L, a HCI 3.8L, to a HCI 4.2L, to a TURBO 4.2L and everylittle mod i have ever done to my car in the last 3.5yrs.

if you need call and talk to ME or John. but if i was you i would ask for John. cause i work in the back and can almost never get to a phone.
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Old 11-01-2005, 09:21 PM   #40
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Wow, I'd heard about it but everyone always said I'm not sure but I think they do tuning !Ok, I will definately be doing that. Maybe some time next week or after, got to study for 2 tests and work overtime because one of our managers is on vacation. I WILL be giving ya'll a call!
Thanks!
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Old 11-01-2005, 09:34 PM   #41
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Quote:
Holy crap!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
How come nobody Knew aboout this place!!!!!!!!!!
Tell me absolutely everything because if they have an actual mustang dyno that's what I'm going to do!
OMGHI2U!!!!!!!!!!oneoneone


I'm pretty sure your the only one that didn't know about it..... that lives around here

Good place
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Old 11-02-2005, 12:03 AM   #42
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

i live thousands of miles away and i know about delk
but seriously the guys that have been running 10+ psi have been running it for low amounts o miles and probobly are not daily driven cars. I have not yet heard of any of the turbo cars, have like more than a few thousand miles on the blown setup, only time will tell i guess.
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Old 11-02-2005, 12:29 AM   #43
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

yeah, im sure a car could handle the psi if it was in good condition. but if your car was been around the block its not in tip top shape anymore. im sure it can handle it, but i think its only a matter of time before something breaks. good luck though and keep us updated.
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Old 11-02-2005, 01:31 AM   #44
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Quote:
good luck though and keep us updated.
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Old 11-02-2005, 01:17 PM   #45
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent
OMGHI2U!!!!!!!!!!oneoneone


I'm pretty sure your the only one that didn't know about it..... that lives around here

Good place
Well I had heard of it but everyone I asked was like "I don't think they'll do tuning", or "I don't think they have a Mustang dyno" or crap like that. Glad I found out for sure.
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Old 11-04-2005, 09:58 PM   #46
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

good luck with the project!! gonna be one bad v6! like those lambos!!
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Old 11-05-2005, 01:51 AM   #47
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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Originally Posted by DarkShadow
Without forging, the stock internals are good for about 11psi (safe min) 12 (IMO, unsafe max).
no, theyre not. even with the fuel system up to par, i wouldnt go past 7psi turboed. while turbo psi and supercharger psi are the same, its the airflow thats going to hurt you. a turbo flows almost double the amount of air at the same psi as a sc does. i also sense a head gasket failure do to lifting the heads at high boost levels, especially a head gasked designed for no forced induction now seeing 11psi fed by a turbo on stock compression pistons.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpectorV
psi is not what kills motors, its the tune. Sure if you max out the psi you will blow something up, but most of the time is a bad tune that does the deed.
no, PSI is exactly what kills motors. especially those motors not meant for ANY boost now seeing ****loads(well, alot compared to most stangs, especially 3.8ers). remember, airflow makes the power, psi is how it gets that airflow into the cylinders. this is why its always best to have a huge *** turbo, and run 16psi and make 40lbs/min than a smaller turbo running at 25psi to make 35lbs/min of airflow. the 25psi turbo is not only going to die faster, 35lbs/min of airflow isnt making as much power as 40lbs/min.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkShadow
Exactly, thank you for being a voice in the wilderness. The engines that get blown are a result of tards that don't know how to tune a tb'd Mustang. Which is why I decided to let Justin handle that part since I'd be willing to bet no one around here knows how to tune one!!
i dont know about you, but after being around mustang forums and seeing sob stories about ****ty premade tunes that sucked for minor bolt on applications, ill do my own tuning. its not too difficult, actually the biggest thing i miss from the dsm world is tuning with my little laptop and stuff, checking short term and long term fuel trims, airflow tables, global fuel settings, fine fuel settings, injector dead times, timing, all the way to being able to turn my fans on at certain temps, or making my CEL flash when it reaches more than 3* of timing retardation due to knock.

and even if the tune they give you is uber rich all over the rpm range with timing pulled to the point of almost no advance, the motor STILL wont handle those psi levels.

ill give you an analogy. what youre doing to your 3.8 by turboing it and going for 12psi, would be like monkey slapping a GT35r turbo into his Evo and running 40psi and expecting it to last long.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkShadow
To a certain point I'll agree with that, but only because I do realize that it will be hard to stay off the pedal. One of my friends has an SRT-4 and he dogs the living s*** out of it, takes it to the track every weekend for midnight madness, finds at least one person to race a day (or so he says). We keep telling him to lay off but he wont listen, he'll listen one day . They come forged but it still wont handle that kind of abuse for long.
I've told my other buds to donkeypunch me if I do stuff like that for longer than the first month! Very good incentive!
but thats almost reverse of reality. his car was MEANT for boost. dodge designed that 2.4 with all means of people running 25-30psi into them and driving them like maniacs. you dont make a normal motor and strap a turbo onto it and release upgrades if the motor cant handle it. hell, by all means, let him beat the **** out of it, itll last longer than most forged rebuilds out there, cause it came that way. the same for evo/dsm's 4g63, the greatest 4cyl motor ever produced. it was MEANT for boost. he can throw 25psi at it and race it through lemans and i can almost gaurantee it will hold up.

i give your 3.8 2 runs. one will fracture the rods but remain mostly intact through the run by sheer luck, the second time of hitting full boost during a run and its shrapnel grenading time. have you ever heard a motor exploding under severe stress, its probably going to haunt you for years, drive you into owning a SUV and strapping lots of bling cause everytime you think about performance the sound of metal shattering and thousands of dollars going down the drain sends you into convulsions.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

in retrospect, i almost admire you for attempting such a feat. one of the very few who turbocharge a otherwise n/a car, and even fewer to do it to a 3.8, and even fewer to do it at the levels youre going for without some sort of race sponsorship. and trying to do all of that and maintain its daily driveability is borderline insane. put it to you this way, i sold my dsm cause turbo's were taking over my life. every waking moment spent researching mod paths and late night backroad tuning, emptying tank after tank of 92 octane gas, just so it would be perfect, just for that one moment when all the power i had would come to bear on an opponent, but knowing that that moment was few and far between. i never really went full balls to the wall with the dsm's final tune, i got one run in at 20psi fully tuned and it scared the **** out of me, spun the front tires when full boost was reached at 3500rpm and torquesteered me almost into a tree at 90. came home that night, and started tearing it down, knowing that either the dsm had to go, or i would be the one going.
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Old 11-05-2005, 02:02 AM   #48
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

oh another note, look on ebay for fmic's(front mount intercoolers). it might sound cheap, but anything is better flowing and cools more than a obx unit. i got a 24x12x3 fmic for 180 bucks, its made by the same company that makes greddy and spearco ones, it just doenst have the name stamped on and the 800$ pricetag. plus you can find long and slender fmic's that will fit your bumper without much custom fabbing and cutting of the bumper cover or support.
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Old 11-05-2005, 12:09 PM   #49
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

I do understand what your saying and do appreciate the warnings, but there's no way I would be doing this if I was the first one ever to run that much psi (10). Off the top of my head, with 100% stock motors, I know of 5 (out of 5) people who have run that much with no problems. Justin runs around 17psi with a stock motor. They all use them as daily drivers (except for Justin), and they all have driven them like maniacs since they got boosted.

For the intercooler, I think I've decided to go ahead and spend the extra on the Spearco.
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Old 11-05-2005, 07:22 PM   #50
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Make sure you havea video camera around when it blows up.
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Old 11-05-2005, 09:01 PM   #51
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

It's going to be fun proving ya'll wrong, lol, hopefully.
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Old 11-05-2005, 10:48 PM   #52
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Why don't y'all just stop bickering. You don't even have the turbo kit yet. There is still 3 months left. Just update us when you get something else. Until then, it's a moot thread
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Old 11-10-2005, 04:05 PM   #53
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Well, I was actualy going to change the title everytime I update it to something like "DarkShadow's Turbo Thread *Updated* 99/99/99 Page ??"
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Old 11-10-2005, 04:56 PM   #54
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

lets keep this thread on topic, so every one please stop *****ing.
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Old 11-11-2005, 10:07 PM   #55
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Turbo Thread *Updated 11/11/05* l:.

Well I just got my Detroit TruTrac installed. it feels very nice and, for now, absolutely will not let me peel out. Can tell a slight difference now in take off because of the whole nonslip thing. Very happy. Install only cost me $200.
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Old 11-13-2005, 06:31 AM   #56
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

i hope you did grears at the same time, did u bump it up to a 3.55?
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Old 11-13-2005, 11:54 AM   #57
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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i hope you did grears at the same time, did u bump it up to a 3.55?
No he is staying 3.27
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Old 11-13-2005, 02:42 PM   #58
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

3.27's arnt bad when youre going boosted, it helps keep the load on the engine to keep the turbo spooled, guys with the 2.3's sometimes have a hard time keeping them spooled when they run 4.10's and 4.56's
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Old 11-13-2005, 03:30 PM   #59
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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No he is staying 3.27
thats what i would have done too. why spend money on da gear. turbos don't need no stinking gear.
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Old 11-13-2005, 09:53 PM   #60
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Yeah, I'm keeping the stock gearing, it's not worth it since I'm getting boosted.
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Old 11-19-2005, 02:13 PM   #61
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Wow so much information i don't know where to begin.

Some people are just tryin hard to sound smart when they don't know a thing.

Lets see psi is psi. so 10 psi on a supercharger is the same amount of volume of 10 psi on a turbocharger. Turbo will make more power b/c of no engine drag and the ability to full boost much sooner.

The only time when its double is when at 3.5k your full boostin at 10 psi with a turbo whereas a supercharger at 3.5k would only have 5psi or so.

As for intercoolers they are not the same cores. Garrett & sparco cores are different from the obx, mishimito, xoxo china cores. I've seen both in person. The china cores do look good and do look like they flow well but they are not the same as a sparco core.

Man there's been tons of procharger cars runnin 11 psi on stock motors yet everybody is fearing 9 psi on forge motor. Hmm doesn't make sence to me but hey run whatever you think is safe.
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Old 11-19-2005, 02:34 PM   #62
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Finally the Guru steps in...
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Old 11-19-2005, 05:03 PM   #63
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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Finally the Guru steps in...
LMAO

i am not sure why he even tried. i did alittle but it got no where. so why try to teach those that already know it all.
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Old 11-21-2005, 11:00 PM   #64
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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Originally Posted by white95v6
LMAO

i am not sure why he even tried. i did alittle but it got no where. so why try to teach those that already know it all.
Thats why i havnt posted in this much either. I could pick and pull this thread apart.
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Old 11-22-2005, 12:28 AM   #65
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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Originally Posted by TuxMask-Andy
Wow so much information i don't know where to begin.

Some people are just tryin hard to sound smart when they don't know a thing.

Lets see psi is psi. so 10 psi on a supercharger is the same amount of volume of 10 psi on a turbocharger. Turbo will make more power b/c of no engine drag and the ability to full boost much sooner.

The only time when its double is when at 3.5k your full boostin at 10 psi with a turbo whereas a supercharger at 3.5k would only have 5psi or so.

As for intercoolers they are not the same cores. Garrett & sparco cores are different from the obx, mishimito, xoxo china cores. I've seen both in person. The china cores do look good and do look like they flow well but they are not the same as a sparco core.

Man there's been tons of procharger cars runnin 11 psi on stock motors yet everybody is fearing 9 psi on forge motor. Hmm doesn't make sence to me but hey run whatever you think is safe.
spend a few years around the dsm crowd, itll teach you the ins and outs of turbo tech really fast. ive worked with 10 second cars(awd 1g, 60trim, dsmlink tuned, meth injection)

psi IS psi, but a turbo flows a whole lot more air at 10psi than most sc ever will, well, depending on turbo. and his motor isnt forged.

and yeah, the cheapie cores are a little behind on quality, but id rather make myself a fmic kit for around 300 bucks custom made for my car, rather than some name brand kit for ~1000 bucks, and spend the rest of the money on other upgrades that will make more of a difference. besides, being in the dsm crowd and making fmic kits for buddies, and comparing a spearco core vs a ebay china one, i can tell you, they are very distinct. if i had access to a flowbench id love to test them, im almost certain they would flow within 50cfm of eachother at around 25psi, which is average boost levels ive been around. and as far as breaking welds at high psi, ive seen big name sheet metal intake manifolds(magnus) split in half before the ebay core did.

Quote:
The only time when its double is when at 3.5k your full boostin at 10 psi with a turbo whereas a supercharger at 3.5k would only have 5psi or so.
i think you have that a bit backwards. even the measly evo16g on my dsm didnt hit 20psi till around 3800rpm. and larger turbo's wouldnt see 15psi till 4k+, that 10 second one didnt hit full 30psi till around 5200rpm. and the only way id see a SC at 5psi at such a low rpm is if it was only running 5psi tops.
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Old 11-22-2005, 12:48 AM   #66
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TuxMask-Andy
Turbo will make more power b/c of no engine drag
I am no turbo expert, and I am assuming by "no engine drag" you mean that turbos dont rob any horsepower from the engine. You have to be kidding me if you really believe that. You can not tell me that pushing exhaust gases through a turbine that has to spin an impeler does not draw any power. period.
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Old 11-22-2005, 11:07 AM   #67
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

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I am no turbo expert, and I am assuming by "no engine drag" you mean that turbos dont rob any horsepower from the engine. You have to be kidding me if you really believe that. You can not tell me that pushing exhaust gases through a turbine that has to spin an impeler does not draw any power. period.
Apparently you're not so don't post on turbos. Exhaust gas goes out wether there's a turbo there or not. The exhaust gas already going out anyway causes the impeller to spin creating a vacuum that increasingly pulls it out faster. There's no pushing from the engine anywhere, it's all the turbo. A supercharger "robs" power from the crank because it's belt driven (however this is realy moot because it makes up for it mostly), the turbo uses the engine waste, like cow **** grows grass, this doesn't make any more stress on the cow just because it's **** grows grass when it's done with it. Period.

EclipseGSTdude: I think you'll find that a lot of the boost cars your familiar with are using higher boosting turbos. As Andy said, people who have had a procharger at 11 psi for years have apparently been forgotten about. There are people who have had turbo set ups for just as long with no problems, the reason you haven't heard about them is because there hasn't been a "name brand" company who builds the kit and tracks their progress for advertisement.
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Old 11-22-2005, 01:01 PM   #68
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkShadow
Apparently you're not so don't post on turbos. Exhaust gas goes out wether there's a turbo there or not. The exhaust gas already going out anyway causes the impeller to spin creating a vacuum that increasingly pulls it out faster. There's no pushing from the engine anywhere, it's all the turbo. A supercharger "robs" power from the crank because it's belt driven (however this is realy moot because it makes up for it mostly), the turbo uses the engine waste, like cow **** grows grass, this doesn't make any more stress on the cow just because it's **** grows grass when it's done with it. Period.

EclipseGSTdude: I think you'll find that a lot of the boost cars your familiar with are using higher boosting turbos. As Andy said, people who have had a procharger at 11 psi for years have apparently been forgotten about. There are people who have had turbo set ups for just as long with no problems, the reason you haven't heard about them is because there hasn't been a "name brand" company who builds the kit and tracks their progress for advertisement.
As long as you have resistance (friction) of any kind, there will be a loss and not a gain. Period.

So SELECT PEOPLE need to stop puffing their chest in this threads and acting like they are the end all of end all on turbo knowledge. No one in here is saying that Turbos rob big engine power but to say that there is no loss period is insane.
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Old 11-22-2005, 01:04 PM   #69
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkShadow
Apparently you're not so don't post on turbos. Exhaust gas goes out wether there's a turbo there or not. The exhaust gas already going out anyway causes the impeller to spin creating a vacuum that increasingly pulls it out faster. There's no pushing from the engine anywhere, it's all the turbo. A supercharger "robs" power from the crank because it's belt driven (however this is realy moot because it makes up for it mostly), the turbo uses the engine waste, like cow **** grows grass, this doesn't make any more stress on the cow just because it's **** grows grass when it's done with it. Period.
WTF are you talking about. Have you ever actually held a turbo in your hands? Or taken one apart? A turbo is a restriction in the exhaust system, no matter how you look at it. It creates backpressure, which can, and will rob horsepower. If you look at a turbo, and you see the size hole the exhaust passes through, you will eat your words quickly. My stock IHI, the exhaust had to pass through a hole that was approxmiately 1 3/4", and it tapered down to even less. Then there is the turbine. My hybrids exhaust port is about 2 1/4" if i remember correctly.

If you actually knew **** about turbos, you would know that they rely on the backpressure they create, the heat from the engine, and exhaust flow. A turbo is not RPM dependant as a supercharger is. If you can create enough heat, and enough flow at any RPM, your turbo will spin enough to create boost.

If you dont understand how heat is involved, ill briefly explain it. Heated air expands, creating more pressure, and more velocity in the exhaust manifolds/crossover tube or whatever design you use for you car, but it creates more pressure and velocity BEFORE the turbo, this heated air is forced through the turbine housing, as the air is getting compressed into the turbo, its getting heated even more so, creating more pressure, and its trying even harder to get through the turbo. That is where your turbo spools and creates boost. If you dont understand, think about this. A turbo does not create boost free revving, unless the turbo is entirely too small. When you place a load on the engine, the engine then creates much more heat, and thats when your turbo spools and creates boost.

This heat wouldnt be created if the turbo wasnt a source of backpressure.

You have more homework to do.
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Old 11-22-2005, 03:47 PM   #70
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Re: .:l DarkShadow's Official Turbo Update Thread l:.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkShadow
Apparently you're not so don't post on turbos. Exhaust gas goes out wether there's a turbo there or not. The exhaust gas already going out anyway causes the impeller to spin creating a vacuum that increasingly pulls it out faster. There's no pushing from the engine anywhere, it's all the turbo. A supercharger "robs" power from the crank because it's belt driven (however this is realy moot because it makes up for it mostly), the turbo uses the engine waste, like cow **** grows grass, this doesn't make any more stress on the cow just because it's **** grows grass when it's done with it. Period.
stick and impeler in the cows *** and see if it ****s as easy.
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