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Old 05-04-2006, 07:04 PM   #1
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Question engine upgrade questions

ok, along with plasma donation, i will also try to pick up a second job over the summer to help engine funds........here is what i have in mind


stage 2+ power pack from ssm

or

heads/cam/ported upper intake/exhaust



the stage 2+ will run about 2k while the other will run about 1k......installation will be around 1.5k-2k for the stage 2+ and about 1k maybe less for the other upgrade. now on to my questions..........

-my car has 57k miles on it right now and will have about ~62k when i upgrade everything, will it hold up with just the h/c/i/e package? how much strain will it put on the other stock parts?

-if i go with with the stage 2+ how will that hold up?

-what other parts will i need for both packages?

-how much stronger/weaker will this make my motor overall?

-what gains can i expect with both packages?
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Old 05-05-2006, 12:09 AM   #2
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Re: engine upgrade questions

i really havent looked all that much into SSM so i dont want to give you gains that will/could be inacurate.Pretty much gonna need a buncha gaskets(manifold gasket, IAC gasket, TB gasket, headgasket)a tune(for the cam) and a hardware package.As for how you'll hold up with h/c/i ..you'll be fine, besides my oil seal blowing(which was not caused by modifications) i havent noticed a bit of wear and im at 65,xxx although i have a GT rear and a few things here and there.I really wouldnt worry about hurting your motor, now if you were going to throw a 12psi blower or turbo(s) on a stock motor id say keep a good eye on things.
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Old 05-05-2006, 02:03 AM   #3
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Re: engine upgrade questions

As long as you stay N/A and don't put together a combo that has to be rev'ed to the moon and back to make power, you'll be fine. Really the only added stress on the bottom end that comes from upgrading H/C/I is the higher RPMs that are usually necessary to take advantage of the new parts. I imagine you'll probably be going with a pretty streetable combo though, so it really shouldn't be an issue.

As for the rest, I'll wait and let someone who actually knows a little bit about the 3.8 (or 3.9, whichever way you swing ) chime in.
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Old 05-05-2006, 08:26 AM   #4
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Re: engine upgrade questions

with an h/c/i, the only things you really need to worry about are gasket seals, bolt torque and tuning. top end by itself won't put the rest of your engine in much, if any, danger; as long as everything is put together and tuned right. it's when you start thinking about forced induction that you'll want to beef up the bottom of the engine

with your 99-04 stang, with stock compression, an h/c/i package will put you around 220 rwhp, assuming top notch porting and a good tune... a top end job will mean exhaust also, single stock exhaust simply won't let the ported intakes flow like they need to.. bottlenecks and such... and don't forget your drivetrain if you intent to get your power to the ground...

you should get teh 4.2 stroker also
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Old 05-05-2006, 08:27 AM   #5
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Re: engine upgrade questions

Quote:
heads/cam/ported upper intake/exhaust
Don't know about that craziness right there, but I'm guessing you want H/C/I.

Roughly both are the same thing it's just how for they port them on the 'stages'. The only way you're gonna damage the bottom end is if you rev it out.

But, since you're gonna be doing all that, you might was well keep saving and add RR to the package.

You're also gonna need a new tune.
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Old 05-05-2006, 09:06 AM   #6
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Re: engine upgrade questions

i would suggest going and driving a 99-04 gt a good bit to see how you like it, thats kind of what your car will feel like after you are done~ 230rwhp~ and it should have a bit more tq but close. If you like it hten you know your money will be well spent.
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Old 05-05-2006, 09:17 AM   #7
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Re: engine upgrade questions

aight, if i go with this, how much hp will i get and what else will i need to upgrade for this


Redlined Performance Mustangs
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:: Rotating Assemblies
:: RPM 3.8L Rotating Assembly
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Old 05-05-2006, 09:38 AM   #8
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Re: engine upgrade questions

I just see a rotating assembly, same compression ratio? if so probably no more power
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Old 05-05-2006, 09:44 AM   #9
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Re: engine upgrade questions

well, keep in mind that if you're gonna just gonna get a rotating assembly (crank, pistons, rods, rings, flywheel) that you'll have to have a local shop to the prep work on your block (cleaning, honing, etc) AND you will still need to buy the top end kit... all of that will add up $ as quickly as buying a prepped block

and why stay 3.8 when you can go 4.3
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Old 05-05-2006, 10:01 AM   #10
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Re: engine upgrade questions

Cause anything over 4.2 can become unstable in the right conditions.
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Old 05-05-2006, 10:01 AM   #11
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Re: engine upgrade questions

you can run into issues on TOP of issues if a local shop screws you. Before you have ANYONE work on your car do a back ground check, ask for references, and when talking to those references ask for other references to get to teh true story. On top check the BBB for filed complaints and any other info you can get locally about problems that are of public record. Finally get a WRITTEN AND SIGNED contract as to what you are getting, what you are paying, and what is warrantied and what is not, get pictures as well, hell record em talking to you. You simply NEVER know when a bit of effort will save you time and money along with headaches.

Take the precautions and come out much happier, also you pay for what you get cheaper is not better always.
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Old 05-05-2006, 07:53 PM   #12
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Re: engine upgrade questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dom
Cause anything over 4.2 can become unstable in the right conditions.
No it wont.. My engine is a 4.3
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Old 05-05-2006, 07:56 PM   #13
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Re: engine upgrade questions

I don't know much about the V6's... but isn't a 4.3 just a 4.2 with a .030 overbore? If so, it's no less stable than a 4.2. Just means you probably won't be able to bore out the block again if it ever needs to be built again.
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Old 05-05-2006, 08:01 PM   #14
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Re: engine upgrade questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by bbunt302
I don't know much about the V6's... but isn't a 4.3 just a 4.2 with a .030 overbore? If so, it's no less stable than a 4.2. Just means you probably won't be able to bore out the block again if it ever needs to be built again.
Yes that is all it is
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Old 05-05-2006, 11:31 PM   #15
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Re: engine upgrade questions

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Originally Posted by Brent
No it wont.. My engine is a 4.3
I'm talkin 4.5 or 4.6.
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Old 05-05-2006, 11:54 PM   #16
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Re: engine upgrade questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpectorV
you can run into issues on TOP of issues if a local shop screws you. Before you have ANYONE work on your car do a back ground check, ask for references, and when talking to those references ask for other references to get to teh true story. On top check the BBB for filed complaints and any other info you can get locally about problems that are of public record. Finally get a WRITTEN AND SIGNED contract as to what you are getting, what you are paying, and what is warrantied and what is not, get pictures as well, hell record em talking to you. You simply NEVER know when a bit of effort will save you time and money along with headaches.

Take the precautions and come out much happier, also you pay for what you get cheaper is not better always.
Not an issue with who we would have do the work....any one of our 3 options would come very highly recommended from a lot of sources. 2 of the 3 have multiple race proven cars...the third worked for one of the other 2 until he started his own business. Quality speed shops are not an issue here.
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Old 05-06-2006, 12:39 PM   #17
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Re: engine upgrade questions


Redlined Performance Mustangs
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ok, thanks to the help of Rob, this is what i am looking into now
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Old 05-06-2006, 02:10 PM   #18
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Re: engine upgrade questions

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Originally Posted by 04stang
I have the following

RPM Max effort Big valve heads
RPM lower intake port matched to the big valve heads
RGR Stage 3 Upper Intake that is ported for a 60mm T/b and shortened runners.
RPM 216/225 cam It is a fairly large 3.8 cam that has a wild lope
Harland Sharp 1.73 Adj roller rockers.
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Old 05-06-2006, 03:04 PM   #19
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Re: engine upgrade questions

i dont know if this comes with new roller rockers and valve springs (i'm assuming so) but if not, i will also upgrade this too along with an 8.8 and p/p upper intake, also, maybe a bigger tb too
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Old 05-07-2006, 09:00 AM   #20
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Re: engine upgrade questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by 04stang
ok, along with plasma donation, i will also try to pick up a second job over the summer to help engine funds........here is what i have in mind


stage 2+ power pack from ssm

or

heads/cam/ported upper intake/exhaust



the stage 2+ will run about 2k while the other will run about 1k......installation will be around 1.5k-2k for the stage 2+ and about 1k maybe less for the other upgrade. now on to my questions..........

-my car has 57k miles on it right now and will have about ~62k when i upgrade everything, will it hold up with just the h/c/i/e package? how much strain will it put on the other stock parts?

-if i go with with the stage 2+ how will that hold up?

-what other parts will i need for both packages?

-how much stronger/weaker will this make my motor overall?

-what gains can i expect with both packages?

I'm not up on SSM's HP gains (Tom does good work) but I can tell you this:

For what you are wanting, I would suggest a cheaper route, and that would be
getting mostly everything but the head porting. The heads flow very well
unported, and the ported heads mostly gain exhaust flow for a better ratio
but the cam can be tweaked with a few extra degrees of duration to "fix"
this situation. Plus, going with an exhaust system upgrade also helps this.

My money-saving soultion for you is as follows...
  • Fully ported (3.8 spec) U/L intake set
  • Custom Cam (My spec thru RPM)
  • X-Cal 2 with MPG and hi-Octane programs
  • Custom Exhaust system


I've seen some of my older cam grinds that RPM sold a bunch of do really well
with unported heads, and the new grinds available can really make a stock
longblock wake up and then the intakes become the bottleneck. Guys with
the old cams and a tune were hitting around 215+ RWHP with no porting!

I'd really save the ported heads for a built block, IMO a totally purpose-built
3.8 forged rods and pistons bottom end can and will (someday) hit 300 RWHP
and very possibly do it in streetable form. Premium Pumpgas
In cases like yours the stock compression is holding you back. Not so much
the CR itself but the piston top design and the lack of quench.
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Old 05-07-2006, 09:21 AM   #21
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Re: engine upgrade questions

well now i am looking at scratching that idea and just goin with a 4.2/4.3 stroker engine that comes with forged internals, go with a higher compression ratio, then do a 150 shot after its installed and broken in
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Old 05-07-2006, 10:37 AM   #22
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Re: engine upgrade questions

Sure you want high compression with these gas prices?
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Old 05-07-2006, 11:34 AM   #23
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Re: engine upgrade questions

i personally would buy a motor in good shape for a rebuild, an rebuild it from the ground up and drop it in, you can take all the time you want, very little down time, and you wont have to settle on what you can afford ATM.
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Old 05-07-2006, 12:05 PM   #24
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Re: engine upgrade questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpectorV
i personally would buy a motor in good shape for a rebuild, an rebuild it from the ground up and drop it in, you can take all the time you want, very little down time, and you wont have to settle on what you can afford ATM.
Apartment complexes typically frown on engine building in their apartments.
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Old 05-20-2006, 05:28 PM   #25
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Re: engine upgrade questions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dom
Sure you want high compression with these gas prices?

I've seen an 11:1 CR buildup running 87 octane... Long Rod 351W!!!
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