2002 V6 mustang cats?

[Rouse]

Iv got a 2002 mustang v6 with dual flow master exhaust I'm not sure what series, but I'm thinking about taking the catalytic converts off. Any downfalls? Benefits??

[sonicpony03]

Benefits...the cats are obviously a restrictive component, so removing them will make the exhaust flow better comparatively speaking. The car will be louder without them as well.

Downfalls...you won't be able to pass emissions inspections without them so keep that in mind if you have inspections where you live. Once you remove the cats your ECU will throw out a code. You'll have to either remove the code by flashing it with a tuner or installing MIL eliminators to basically trick the ECU by bypassing that signal.

A v6 being louder isn't necessarily a better thing...I've always found v6's that are quieter with a crisp tone are better sounding than a loudass v6.

I'd recommend leaving the cats, or if you want to make the car flow a little bit better and louder remove two cats. High flow aftermarket cats are another option but they are expensive and the money could be better spent elsewhere.

[Project Pony]

Originally Posted by sonicpony03

Benefits...the cats are obviously a restrictive component, so removing them will make the exhaust flow better comparatively speaking. The car will be louder without them as well.

Downfalls...you won't be able to pass emissions inspections without them so keep that in mind if you have inspections where you live. Once you remove the cats your ECU will throw out a code. You'll have to either remove the code by flashing it with a tuner or installing MIL eliminators to basically trick the ECU by bypassing that signal.

A v6 being louder isn't necessarily a better thing...I've always found v6's that are quieter with a crisp tone are better sounding than a loudass v6.

I'd recommend leaving the cats, or if you want to make the car flow a little bit better and louder remove two cats. High flow aftermarket cats are another option but they are expensive and the money could be better spent elsewhere.

+1 on keeping the cats, at least two of them. Taking them out doesn't magically make our v6's sound good. The two or three catless sixxers I've heard in person are louder, but sound quality went out the window....

[V6 stang]

I have only one cat, it throws a code but has been erased. Luckily I love in a small town where they don't check ur emission stuff hardcore. So I pass. But my car is louder then other v6's and I have turndowns.. Love the sounds tho it's really nice and aggressive sounding to me

[SpectorV]

it will be loud (not in a good way) and you dont want to lose any back pressure so I would leave them.

[mustangg2000]

As far as back pressure that's not true .. long as u don't have pipes over 2.25 you will be perfectly fine and sound is based on opinion .. the back pressure myth is simply that a myth

---------- Post added at 02:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:33 PM ----------

http://www.thumpertalk.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=659727

To back up my statement

[Eturner]

Originally Posted by mustangg2000

As far as back pressure that's not true .. long as u don't have pipes over 2.25 you will be perfectly fine and sound is based on opinion .. the back pressure myth is simply that a myth

---------- Post added at 02:35 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:33 PM ----------

http://www.thumpertalk.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=659727

To back up my statement

+11 on the back pressure myth and the wright up!.. That is a good one there too!..

I also posted up three wright ups that I found a couple months ago!.. They are in the General Discussion forum called "The Myths Of Back Pressure"

[Project Pony]

Stacey Davids has an awesome bit about the back pressure myth on gears

[Eturner]

Originally Posted by Project Pony

Stacey Davids has an awesome bit about the back pressure myth on gears

If your talking about the one where he also talking about the differences in pipe diameter, then I've seen it too!.. It was pretty basic but still a good bit!..

[blackhawk 1]

i wouldnt do it

[Rouse]

Okay, I'll leave them on. Thanks guys!

[Eturner]

Originally Posted by Rouse

Okay, I'll leave them on. Thanks guys!

Do what you want with your car!.. But if your looking to improve performance then one of the best ways is to eliminate the cats!..

[mustangg2000]

Originally Posted by Eturner

Do what you want with your car!.. But if your looking to improve performance then one of the best ways is to eliminate the cats!..

I agree got to cut out stock cats

[Project Pony]

Minimal performence gains with maximum crap sound, have at it!

[Rouse]

Well it's a v6 so I wasn't completely concerned with the performance. I'm more interested in it sounding descent.

[Eturner]

Originally Posted by Project Pony

Minimal performence gains with maximum crap sound, have at it!

Usually you'll see about 10-15hp gain!.. Sound all depends on what type of mufflers and headers/exhaust manifold you have!.. Also depends on if you go with an O/R X-pipe or H-pipe or if you go with a ProChamber!..

---------- Post added at 07:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:10 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Rouse

Well it's a v6 so I wasn't completely concerned with the performance. I'm more interested in it sounding descent.

My opinion is if you can improve both then why not do it?.. But like I said it's your ride so you do what you want!..

[mustangg2000]

Originally Posted by Rouse

Well it's a v6 so I wasn't completely concerned with the performance. I'm more interested in it sounding descent.

Bud cut em get some flowmasters ...bam wicked sound .. had mine for a few years still get complimented on the sound

[Project Pony]

Op, listen to videos of catless v6's, you'll change your mind quick. Unless you have long tubes and a cam it sounds really bad, like fart can Honda bad, at anything other than idle. That being said its your car....

[mustangg2000]

No it don't cut off with turn downs .. ain't got a bad sound at any rpm..

[Cobrarunnin9s]

Honestly those flowmasters you have are more of a restriction than the cats are, atleast the cats are straight through design the exhaust gas jus passes through a screen which is the catalyst. Having chambered mufflers creates backpressure in your exhaust which is bad all day long....

---------- Post added at 10:54 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:42 PM ----------

Originally Posted by Cobrarunnin9s

Honestly those flowmasters you have are more of a restriction than the cats are, atleast the cats are straight through design the exhaust gas jus passes through a screen which is the catalyst. Having chambered mufflers creates backpressure in your exhaust which is bad all day long....

But today, the problems that the automotive industry has experienced in the 1960s could have been solved in a different way. Gone were the days when designs for power and emission control should be made separately. Today, one can create powerful engines without increasing its emission level. Today, rather than redesigning and decreasing the size of the engines, automobile engineers would have resorted to using properly designed catalytic converters.

Catalytic converters, or cats as they are often called, are emission control products that clean up the exhausts from gasoline-powered engines. Catalytic converters are just one of the many parts of a vehicle engine's exhaust system which is responsible for letting the engine's waste products out of the engine while keeping it free from harmful elements. Catalytic converters filter the combustion byproducts of the vehicle's engine, particularly hydrocarbons, carbon monoxide and other harmful byproducts, and keep the exhaust of the vehicle free from harmful substances and completely environment friendly.

Ford vehicles are originally equipped with high quality and high performance Ford catalytic converters that would function well for your vehicle. Ford catalytic converters are guaranteed to keep the exhausts of your vehicle free from harmful substances. But while keeping your vehicle exhausts clean, Ford catalytic converters does not hamper in the regular power production and performance of your vehicle. By allowing the right amount of air to enter your vehicle's engine and not restricting its flow, Ford catalytic converters does not reduce the power potential of your vehicle's engine.

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[Project Pony]

Originally Posted by mustangg2000

No it don't cut off with turn downs .. ain't got a bad sound at any rpm..

Post a video for us. Let him hear what you think sounds good (no offense, but everyone has their own tastes). I've heard a couple sixxers with stock headers, no cam, and flowmaster 40's and some with 44's in person and they are quite embarrassing really. They sound horrible as soon as the gas pedal is touched....but that's just me. OP spend some time listening to different setups on you tube. Find what YOU like. If you like the sound of no cats then then cut em out! If you want a much better sound while having no cats then look into some longtubes, cam, an h pipe and use turndowns.

[V6 stang]

My car has a aggressive growl to it. Not sure if that's cuz I have one cat and don't have both cut? Vroom!

[Nog51]

Well, i have a single, super 40 series flow master muffler turn down with a set of pypes highflow converters...my car has a very mean growl to it and sounds much light a larger engine even at idle...i highly recommend the pypes high flow cats. If i have time later ill post a sound clip for ya.

[clifford]

I have a stock system but the previous owner had the cats removed. I think mine sounds decent and it has a nice rumble to it. Muffler is stock too. At WOT, it gives off this 350Zish sound. I kind of like it.

[Nog51]

Might wanna throw some cats on there bro, without them, the oil on ur cyl walls will wear off from it running rich. Also itll mess up ur engine if you dont have any backpressure.

[Project Pony]

You don't need or want back pressure, man this myth is out of control! Its the loss of air velocity that is the issue when people credit back pressure for them losing low end torque. Usually a result of using too big of piping. Air needs to get out of and away from the motor as fast as possible, the more air you can move the more power. This is a fact that we all know. So how does it make sense that you would want to restrict airflow with "back pressure"?

---------- Post added at 09:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:42 AM ----------

As for burning valves, once again not really back pressure causing it but a lean run condition as a result of moving more air through the motor without increasing the amount of fuel in the mixture.. Retune and presto lean condition is gone! You want as close to zero back pressure as possible

[Eturner]

Originally Posted by Project Pony

You don't need or want back pressure, man this myth is out of control! Its the loss of air velocity that is the issue when people credit back pressure for them losing low end torque. Usually a result of using too big of piping. Air needs to get out of and away from the motor as fast as possible, the more air you can move the more power. This is a fact that we all know. So how does it make sense that you would want to restrict airflow with "back pressure"?

---------- Post added at 09:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:42 AM ----------

As for burning valves, once again not really back pressure causing it but a lean run condition as a result of moving more air through the motor without increasing the amount of fuel in the mixture.. Retune and presto lean condition is gone! You want as close to zero back pressure as possible

+11. Preach it bro!!!.... Lol.

Yes back pressure is a total myth!.. It is something that you do not need nor want if you are going after performance!...

[V6 stang]

Originally Posted by clifford

I have a stock system but the previous owner had the cats removed. I think mine sounds decent and it has a nice rumble to it. Muffler is stock too. At WOT, it gives off this 350Zish sound. I kind of like it.

+1

[Nog51]

Mmmm idk about all of that man. I dont know entirely too much about it, but i do know that a guy thats been doing exhaust for over 30 years, a friend of mine's gramps, said it xould be catastrophic to not have any backpressure. But hell, its ur car. Pretty sure the converters i am currently running gives you top notch performance, right up there with no cats. Id rather play it safe as of now thou lol

[Cobrarunnin9s]

Originally Posted by Nog51

Mmmm idk about all of that man. I dont know entirely too much about it, but i do know that a guy thats been doing exhaust for over 30 years, a friend of mine's gramps, said it xould be catastrophic to not have any backpressure. But hell, its ur car. Pretty sure the converters i am currently running gives you top notch performance, right up there with no cats. Id rather play it safe as of now thou lol

Stuff a potato in your exhaust and see how well your engine runs. Your friends gramps must be a chevy guy because they all seem to think that engines need backpressure to run....

Oh and as I posted earlier in this thread ford uses high flow cats out of the factory so replacing the stock cats with high flow cats is a waste of time and money but hey it's your money not mine.

[Nog51]

Lol idk what they consider "high flow", but mine were all but that. Also, my car had 4 cats on it, now it has two. And I HAD to change mine, I didnt just say, " today looks like a great day to spend $550 on parts and labor to refab my exhaust to make these after market cats fit." however, they made my exhaust sound 110% better and i dont regret it one bit. With that being said, the power gains ARE noticeable and well worth it (i dont "waste" my money). Lastly, his grandpa has been a ford guy and has raced fords all his life, if he says my engine needs backs pressure, im probably going to take his word on it. Im not telling anyone to believe me, im merely throwing out what I know as a suggestion. If he, or anyone else for that matter, wants to lose the lubercation on their cyl walls, more power to ya.

[Eturner]

Ford does not use "high flow cats" from the factory!.. When you can take off your cats and instantly have about 10-15 hp more then they where not high flow cats!..

And anyone who has been truly racing cars and all knows that back pressure is a myth!.. Take a look at any real race car and tell me what type of exhaust you find!.. Odds are you will see Long Tube Headers and straight piped!.. No cats and more than likely no mufflers of any kind!.. So what does that say?.. Back pressure is not needed!... I have put about 80,000 miles on my car with my O/R X-pipe and my car still runs strong!.. I put it on when my car had 30,000 miles and I'm now at about 112,000 miles!..

---------- Post added at 01:22 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:15 AM ----------

Lastly your not going to lose lubrication on your cylinder walls!.. Your exhaust has nothing to do with your oil!..

Lol. My last car had close to 170,000 miles put on it with out any cats and it had no problems!.. It didn't even have a proper tune!.. Lol.

[Cobrarunnin9s]

Never said you wouldnt gain power By removing your cats but compared to other factory cats ford's are much higher quality and since the newer cars have 6 cats dropping down to 2 would definitely provide an increase in power. I really don't care about them. I run LT's and an O/R x. I have no worries about passing a visual inspection and mil eliminators kill the code and allow you to pass the standard obd2 emissions test here in Missouri.

[Eturner]

I got rid of the cats on my Mustang GT and gained about 15hp from it!.. Years ago when I had my '96 Monte-Carlo I did the same thing and gained about 15hp from it!.. Sorry but Ford does not put high flow cats on their cars!..

[V6 stang]

You need a welding machine to remove your cats?