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Old 11-13-2003, 10:01 AM   #1
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3.8 displacement

Just for the record, you can bore up to .060 on most engines and the most you can stroke a 3.8 to is 4.6 on a non s/c block and 4.4 on an s/c block
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Old 11-13-2003, 11:50 AM   #2
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ok : kinda random though
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Old 11-13-2003, 11:57 AM   #3
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Wow nice info but where did that come from HAHHHAHAHAHHAHAHAH I assume that someone at sometime asked that question
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Old 11-13-2003, 12:55 PM   #4
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thanks dood :thumb2:
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Old 11-13-2003, 09:44 PM   #5
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cid for 3.8

yes someone asked this in another post thought I'd pass along something useful
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Old 11-14-2003, 07:12 AM   #6
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That is cool I figured there was someone who asked !!!! It is useful info
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Old 11-14-2003, 11:20 AM   #7
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but faulty

I'm doing mucho measuring and I know I can get more
in both cases. However, these figures do work in nearly every case.
SAFELY!
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Old 11-14-2003, 11:39 AM   #8
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Charles' engine will be bigger in at least one of these areas.
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Old 11-14-2003, 12:45 PM   #9
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HUMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM!!!! Robert up to some wicked mojo for Charles
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Old 11-14-2003, 09:34 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RGR
Charles' engine will be bigger in at least one of these areas.
i keep forgetting to email you back. I will soon, lol.
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Old 11-14-2003, 09:57 PM   #11
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.060 overbore??? Maybe, but that sounds like a lot to me....can you even buy pistons for that much overbore, seems to me the cylinder walls would be getting sorta thin too. .030 to .040 is what you usually hear about. The main reason for boring is to clean up messed up cylinder walls and to straighten up a cylinder that has gotten mis shapen from wear, there is generally no reason to go more than necessary to achieve these objectives, you aren't really going to get enough increase in your displacement to make an appreciable difference in my opinion. For that stroking is the definite way to go. Another thing that used to be done more in the days of bigger block engines, but not so much now I would think is de-stroking, or shortening the stroke, this made a smaller displacement but supposedly allowed the engine to wind up faster, Corey, being a Chevy man you might know more on this than I would???
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Old 11-14-2003, 10:06 PM   #12
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With all due respect RGR, .060 overbore is standard( ok standard for most) practice, and anything over that is risky. I will stay within accepted practice and still kill rice handily.
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Old 11-14-2003, 10:15 PM   #13
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Well the 68 Camaro Z28 had a 302CID motor in it that was derived from a 327 block with a 283 crank it was a long winded car that did not get going till 4000 rpm but it was really designed as a race car for road course. But I must say when you talk Big block Chevy you have the big *** Rat motors that were 454 punched out to 513 and bigger going 60 over. I use to take the 350's to 30 over and that was enough for me but others went further
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Old 11-15-2003, 11:32 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plstktnkr2
With all due respect RGR, .060 overbore is standard( ok standard for most) practice, and anything over that is risky. I will stay within accepted practice and still kill rice handily.
U are right on plstktnkr2, I agree that 60 over is recognized as
safe and sane for any V6 I have seen. But for the meticulous
machinist U can measure and maybe get more!
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Old 11-15-2003, 07:02 PM   #15
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And where is any of this been actually done other than in "theory"?
A viable 4.6 engine?
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Old 11-15-2003, 10:15 PM   #16
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www.moranaracing.com has viable stroker kit for 4.6
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Old 11-15-2003, 10:25 PM   #17
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Need a better link.......
Sounds good, I wish I could know more.
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Old 11-16-2003, 12:05 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plstktnkr2
www.moranaracing.com has viable stroker kit for 4.6
try this one: http://www.moranav6racing.com/
http://www.moranav6racing.com/stroker.html
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Old 11-16-2003, 11:59 AM   #19
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They list it (4.6 stroker) but I've heard it was a bust.

Not from Morana, but from a customer who lives there.
Said it still needed balance work. I'm sure a 4.6 can be done,
my machinist's first level stroker (offset ground 4.2 crank)
comes out at 4.5 liters with only a .030" overbore. We're
not fooling around with factory parts and hyper pistons,
these will be serious power-adder capable strokers
Later I'd like to do an econo-stroker w/hypereutectics
but most ppl. now want the forged bottom ends.
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Old 11-26-2003, 03:29 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rick0636
can you even buy pistons for that much overbore, ...
The main reason for boring is to clean up messed up cylinder walls and to straighten up a cylinder that has gotten mis shapen from wear, there is generally no reason to go more than necessary to achieve these objectives...
ummm, c'mon Rick... that's what custom pistons are for. You can have
them made in any size you want. :p
And yes that's the normal reason for boring... to clean it up and straighten
it. No you won't get much power from a couple extra cubes but the
advantage from being able to unshroud the valves that much more is
why one might want to bore further.
Yes 60 is the rule of thumb for safe. If you take careful measurements on
your specific block to make sure you don't have problems with core shift
then you can go further.
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Old 11-26-2003, 03:36 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikael
No you won't get much power from a couple extra cubes but the
advantage from being able to unshroud the valves that much more is
why one might want to bore further.
Yes people keep thinking boring is just to increase displacement... first, if you're going in there to begin with, you might as well bore it out as much as is safe to get a few more cubes as well as (and more importantly) have more room for the valves as mikael said.
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Old 11-26-2003, 03:47 PM   #22
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Yep, and I have blocks on hand that are just for chamber matching.
The only V6 shop that does this AFAIK. Mik will have it soon too, he
has done stock bore chamber matching, right Mik?
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Old 11-28-2003, 11:11 AM   #23
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Mik will have it soon too, he
has done stock bore chamber matching, right Mik?
Correct. I have the stock bore, just haven't gotten around to boring
the other half of the motor. I'm missing the dowels on that side so I
wouldn't be able to keep the head in place anyway. I'll get around to it
some day. I don't have many customers who have other than stock
bottom ends anyway.
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Old 11-28-2003, 12:17 PM   #24
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I measured the dowel size, .625"

I need to make some, if I find the right material size
I'll send you a pair.

I have a piece of bar stock that might be .625"
if I can find it.
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Old 11-28-2003, 02:16 PM   #25
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That makes sense as long as the cylinder walls aren't too weak then I would say go for it, you are going to have to get new oversized pistons anyway, and the part about more room for valves does sound good, especially if you are going to big valve heads.
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Old 11-29-2003, 06:53 AM   #26
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IMO any valve bigger than stock intakes really needs bigger bore.
It's hard to get the flow out of a bigger I valve in a stock bore, it
still works but flow is limited somewhat with a stock bore. Remember
that deal with you and Morana and big valves, Rick? I'd imagine
the stock bore was part of the problem.
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Old 11-29-2003, 12:16 PM   #27
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Could that have been why I was lacking vacuum at low rpms?
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Old 11-29-2003, 12:38 PM   #28
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doubt it

unless the cam was really big too
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Old 11-29-2003, 12:45 PM   #29
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Well, I don't think the cam was, but maybe the cam and 1:8 roller rockers combined, who knows, I don't even remember the specs.
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Old 11-29-2003, 12:48 PM   #30
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most Mcams were Ford grind 5.0 equivalents so it could have been
slightly large. Most tuners may not have known the overall specs...
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Old 11-29-2003, 12:57 PM   #31
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That was a replacement long block installed by a local ford dealer before I got the car, I am not sure who remanufactured it, whether it was ford or an aftermarket job, it probably did have stock bore though.
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Old 12-07-2003, 11:07 PM   #32
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As far as the 4.6 goes, you can look and it and tell that it's not gonna be balanced. 281 cubic inches streched between 6 cylinders is gonna be rough. That's why it's a N/A engine to begin with.

4.2L or 241 cubic engine is a much better choice as far as I believe.
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Old 12-08-2003, 08:20 AM   #33
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Quote:
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As far as the 4.6 goes, you can look and it and tell that it's not gonna be balanced. 281 cubic inches streched between 6 cylinders is gonna be rough. That's why it's a N/A engine to begin with.

4.2L or 241 cubic engine is a much better choice as far as I believe.
255 c.i. man

The 4.5 I've been working on is almost the same stroke
as Morana's 4.4, and same .030" overbore, Morana's is actually
4.47 Liters (could call it a 4.5) My setup is a 4.499 Liter and I am
calling it a 4.5 liter, it's about 2 cubes bigger, easier to build than
the parts he uses, but more expensive (forged aftermarket pistons
and rods, instead of OEM Chrysler rods and hypereutectic Buick pistons)
Less machining and better parts IMO makes a more desirable stroker.
My machine shop has used LOTS more stroke with similar deck height
in other stroker setups, so they believe they can do it in a V6.
I'm gonna find out
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Old 12-29-2003, 10:23 PM   #34
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hey RGR need to talk to you ready for the cam but lost the e-mail
the 300 HP cam for my 4.25 (4.3) think you said
6500 rpm limit
.600 lift
1.8 and 1.7 rockers
can we get together for specifics?
Rick
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Old 12-30-2003, 05:28 AM   #35
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yeah, email me!
I can fix you up
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