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Old 03-19-2012, 01:35 PM   #36
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Re: blowby?

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Originally Posted by saleen5.0 View Post
Ok well thanks forbthe info guys... But one question wat is The fmu?
Let me tell u All that i know about My car,
I have a xxx 306 block with holley systemax upper and lower, with a edelbrock 75mm tb An tb spacer,
vortech v1 supercharger withim pretty sure An 8lb pulley maybe a Lil smaller,
76mm maf, red top 30lb injectors, aluminum heads that are All studded, and have dual valve springsbut idk wat make of heads, 1.7 crane cam pro gold roller rockers with 6.275/ 0.080 pushro ds, speed pro flat top pistons .30 over, and a pretty lopey cam, All msd ignition, header to tip bassani exhaust, and underdrive pulleys... Thats just boltons to The motor.. I do have The pcv for a turbo Coupe.. All smogg equipment is still being rAn
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Originally Posted by saleen5.0 View Post
Oh ya duh, lol thanks.. So wat do u think about My setup trojanhorse?
Looks pretty good and it should make some good power.
Whats the xxx 306 block mean?


It would be nice to figure out what heads you have and know valve & port sizes and flow capabilities if you can ever find them.
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Old 03-19-2012, 01:36 PM   #37
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Xxx means roller block
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Old 03-19-2012, 01:46 PM   #38
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Re: blowby?

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Xxx means roller block
I knew that. Aged brain wave deficiency strikes AGAIN!


Thank you
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Old 03-19-2012, 02:02 PM   #39
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Haha I knew you did.
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Old 03-19-2012, 09:11 PM   #40
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Ya ive Ben looking everywhere and i cant find anything on these heads... About Wat HP do u think im running? And oh ya i just picked up a set of green top 42lb injectors
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Old 03-19-2012, 09:23 PM   #41
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its really hard to guess what hp you are running especially without know the heads.HCI topend if they are decent heads and 8 psi should probably be ove 400 give or take at the crank. i say give or take very loosely because we just dont know.do you have any pics?

---------- Post added at 09:21 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:19 PM ----------

i dont remember but you still have the heads on the car?sometimes the numbers are cover ped by parts like ontop of the heads by the intake which are really hard to find.and others will have something on the end under the alternator or ac brackes which you would have to remove to see.

---------- Post added at 09:23 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:21 PM ----------

when you install the injectors ou will probably need to get it tuned.and make sure your maf is calibrated for them.dont go romping on it till you have taken care of these things.
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Old 03-20-2012, 11:33 AM   #42
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Re: blowby?

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Originally Posted by dreamstang View Post
Hey svt.

What size fuel lines are you running?and is that even relavint to the low pressure your running? I'm just curious also with the lower pressure your running.do you use a wideband or anything to tune with?

Your knowledge is obviously way above mine and I'm just a little more curious of your tuning techniques as I know I've heard you say how reliable your setup is.and that your been running it for years.
my fuel lines are stock, except for when you get to the rail. i run these giant fuel log type rails that bbk supplies with their intake. however. for low boost applications (14lbs or less) the stock lines are usualy adequete as long as you are running a 255lph pump.

i dont have a wideband, i tune by ear... and by smell. i know it sounds crazy. but a few local guys ask me to look or tune their cars.

my fuel pressure is low cause the engine doesnt need all the fuel.

i tune the injector for the fuel requirements. injectors work in a range. you can get more or less from an injectors rated range. like getting 26-27lbs from a 24lbs injector, you can also get less from it.

"ford fuel injection and electronic engin control" ..by charles probst. is the most boring but yet educational book to learn sum basic tuning. if u know how to apply it. ive read this book prolly 5-7 times.

"how to build supercharged and turbocharged small block fords"...by bob mclurg

"dyno proven 5.0 liter performance test-5.0 liter ford dyno test"....by richard holdner

and another book called "supercharger and turbo charger theory".. i cant remember the author... itsa engine builders type publication...

i encourage everyone to read these books. they are only tools, not bibles. nothing replaces hands on. but these publications will get most ppl pointed in the right direction.

learn how the injector works....

wut year pcm and wut version processor is in the pcm.... this will help u figure out your tuning limitations...

learn how the pcm works...so u will know when to make the engine adjustments and how long it takes the pcm to respond and make corrections.

---------- Post added at 10:07 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:02 AM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by saleen5.0 View Post
Ya ive Ben looking everywhere and i cant find anything on these heads... About Wat HP do u think im running? And oh ya i just picked up a set of green top 42lb injectors
@8psi and if u have typical aluminum heads...

ima say approx 375hp and maybe around 400ft.lbs of torque. at the wheels.

again itsa guessestimate... but the guys i know at that boost level and 160/194 heads..im sure my guesse is pretty close

---------- Post added at 10:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:07 AM ----------

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Originally Posted by Trojan Horse View Post
I have an online subscription to 5.0 Mustang Magazine. Is that the one you are referring to?
Maybe I can look up the back issue articles. If you have time sometimes PM me a few dates and article names and I'll try to look them up and add them to my store of saved information.


! I think I just noticed what our biggest discrepancies occur from.
You are talking about no outside tuning and stock ECU while I'm geared toward and always thinking of using the AFM piggyback tuner or a tuned chip being part of the package.


No man, I don't think of you in the term "cheapskate". The user title I gave you and comments I may make are in jest only. I actually admire your ability to do more with less and I'm willing to learn as much as I can from you.


I just can't wrap my brain around how you can get enough fuel at that low pressure and small injector size.
Sometimes I am extremely dense though and it takes a while before I can figure out for myself how something works or should work, but I usually get there in time. Much patience required.

i think you are right on our pcm tuning differences...


ok, here's one. 5.0 magazine
january 2010...page 74

419hp fox gt/garage clean...

me and this guys set-up is almost identical besides intake... he is running 24's. with stock everyting like me might i add...

---------- Post added at 10:33 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:12 AM ----------

hay trojan....

here's another in 5.0 magazine.

october 2004..page 154..."power hunt"

this car was already built and they did upgrade to 42's...

but coming into the door the car made 429hp....412ftlbs torque .....on 30lbs injectors and pro-m 75 ..which is wut i have.
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Old 03-20-2012, 11:45 AM   #43
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Re: blowby?

I found the article - 1989 Mustang GT 5.0 - Garage Clean - 419HP Fox GT

The key to his success is:


1. He never races or abuses the car.
2. He's running methanol injection.
3. He's happy with his power level.
4. He rarely drives it.
5. He spent all his money on his garage floor.


I can see how he gets by, but for someone who drives their car a lot and drive it hard at times like I do mine, I don't think his setup would work out very well.


I can appreciate his accomplishments, but I don't think they would mesh well with more frequently driven and abused Mustangs.


My intent is to push the limits of the stock block and try to make it live a reasonably long life at elevated power levels. I know it's possible as others before me have tried and done it. I just want to see how far it can go and how long it can survive. So, I will use every trick and crutch I can to accomplish that.


Thanks for pointing out the article.
I enjoyed reading it.
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Old 03-20-2012, 12:06 PM   #44
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Re: blowby?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Trojan Horse View Post
I found the article - 1989 Mustang GT 5.0 - Garage Clean - 419HP Fox GT

The key to his success is:


1. He never races or abuses the car.
2. He's running methanol injection.
3. He's happy with his power level.
4. He rarely drives it.
5. He spent all his money on his garage floor.


I can see how he gets by, but for someone who drives their car a lot and drive it hard at times like I do mine, I don't think his setup would work out very well.


I can appreciate his accomplishments, but I don't think they would mesh well with more frequently driven and abused Mustangs.


My intent is to push the limits of the stock block and try to make it live a reasonably long life at elevated power levels. I know it's possible as others before me have tried and done it. I just want to see how far it can go and how long it can survive. So, I will use every trick and crutch I can to accomplish that.


Thanks for pointing out the article.
I enjoyed reading it.

i can find plenty more...your kinda splitn hairs at this point.

i used to drive mine everyday with the 5800rpm launch everytime i leave my house.

the point of me finding the articles was to point out that u can make more than 400hp on 24#injectors and 420hp+ with 30lbs.... safely and reliably.

there's guys that drive hard wit the same and similar set-up.

like i said before, if you are goin for 5-600hp... this stuff doesnt apply. but 450 or less is doable on a stock bottom end, its safe, and reliable.

anyways....if u beat the crap outa any motor, even bone stock....its gonna pop eventualy. so how often someone drives doenst really count that much. if u r wrapn 6k+ every time u get a chance. its gonna snap at sum point...regardless of who built it. unless u bought a roush/yates nascar motor. but those pop too...


sorry, got off track again... i was just poitn out the injectors...not bottom end.
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Old 03-20-2012, 12:06 PM   #45
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Re: blowby?

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Originally Posted by svtlx View Post


hay trojan....

here's another in 5.0 magazine.

october 2004..page 154..."power hunt"

this car was already built and they did upgrade to 42's...

but coming into the door the car made 429hp....412ftlbs torque .....on 30lbs injectors and pro-m 75 ..which is wut i have.
Can't find that one, it may be too old to be online.
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Old 03-20-2012, 12:34 PM   #46
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Re: blowby?

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i can find plenty more...your kinda splitn hairs at this point.

i used to drive mine everyday with the 5800rpm launch everytime i leave my house.

the point of me finding the articles was to point out that u can make more than 400hp on 24#injectors and 420hp+ with 30lbs.... safely and reliably.

there's guys that drive hard wit the same and similar set-up.

like i said before, if you are goin for 5-600hp... this stuff doesnt apply. but 450 or less is doable on a stock bottom end, its safe, and reliable.

anyways....if u beat the crap outa any motor, even bone stock....its gonna pop eventualy. so how often someone drives doenst really count that much. if u r wrapn 6k+ every time u get a chance. its gonna snap at sum point...regardless of who built it. unless u bought a roush/yates nascar motor. but those pop too...


sorry, got off track again... i was just poitn out the injectors...not bottom end.
Yeah, I'm splitting hairs. Since I don't have many I have to.


I hate trying to talk through text it is so impersonal and hard to get your true meaning across.


I'm not dissing the article or achievements and you've proven it can be done.
I am trying to rationalize for myself how it is possible with such small fuel flow.


Please do not be offended by what I type. I don't mean to sound offensive, it just comes out that way sometimes.


I don't necessarily mean "beat the crap" out of them, but they should be able to withstand a few 1/4 mile passes every now and then.
My curiosity there is how the smaller injectors and no tune can deliver enough fuel for the WOT blasts without melting a piston.


I'd love to see some Wideband data on exactly what the air/fuel mixture is doing in that scenario.
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Old 03-20-2012, 12:58 PM   #47
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Re: blowby?

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Originally Posted by Trojan Horse View Post
Yeah, I'm splitting hairs. Since I don't have many I have to.


I hate trying to talk through text it is so impersonal and hard to get your true meaning across.


I'm not dissing the article or achievements and you've proven it can be done.
I am trying to rationalize for myself how it is possible with such small fuel flow.


Please do not be offended by what I type. I don't mean to sound offensive, it just comes out that way sometimes.


I don't necessarily mean "beat the crap" out of them, but they should be able to withstand a few 1/4 mile passes every now and then.
My curiosity there is how the smaller injectors and no tune can deliver enough fuel for the WOT blasts without melting a piston.


I'd love to see some Wideband data on exactly what the air/fuel mixture is doing in that scenario.
Yyour right bout not hearn someons voice on text..can come across wrong...

admittedly, i can be a bit hypersensative at times...

anyway, a standard stroke boosted motor doesnt need as much fuel as most ppl think.

i was just readn an article an old article. these ppl are making 600hp on a 408 (stroked 351) and are using 42's to make that hp. so making 430-450 on 30's shouldnt be so far fetched of an idea.

its in 5.0 magazine "over the top" december 2004..page 42




now, on page 64 of same december 2004 issue..

this guy has bone stock coupe...aod wit e7's...and 17psi of boost. ....he's running 42#injecxtor if it makes u feel better..lol.

stock a9p pcm

371hp and 510.9ftlbs of torque..

runs 10's....and this is a full race car on slicks (10.919 @ 123.64mph)

even the intake is stock.....


its guys like this that i built my car around....



and this is y i brag about walkn all over guys who have double the amount of money in their car than me....

and y i tell ppl that their mustang is capable of doin more with less than wut most think they can.

u just have to understand the pcms.... and know how to take advantage of the low compression stock heads which is your best buddy under boost conditions.
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racing aod, 2700 stall, 3.42 gears, ported e7, 308ci, 1.7rr, comp .560valve springs, gear drive, high dwell module, msd 6a & coil, bbk off road xpipe, mac cat back, 30lbs inj, pro-m 90mm, welded subframe connectors, boxed upper & lower trailing arms, spherical axle bushings, 255/50/16 tires, 255lph pump, 456hp
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Old 03-20-2012, 01:20 PM   #48
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Re: blowby?

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Yyour right bout not hearn someons voice on text..can come across wrong...

admittedly, i can be a bit hypersensative at times...

anyway, a standard stroke boosted motor doesnt need as much fuel as most ppl think.

i was just readn an article an old article. these ppl are making 600hp on a 408 (stroked 351) and are using 42's to make that hp. so making 430-450 on 30's shouldnt be so far fetched of an idea.

its in 5.0 magazine "over the top" december 2004..page 42

now, on page 64 of same december 2004 issue..

this guy has bone stock coupe...aod wit e7's...and 17psi of boost. ....he's running 42#injecxtor if it makes u feel better..lol.

stock a9p pcm

371hp and 510.9ftlbs of torque..

runs 10's....and this is a full race car on slicks (10.919 @ 123.64mph)

even the intake is stock.....

its guys like this that i built my car around....

and this is y i brag about walkn all over guys who have double the amount of money in their car than me....

and y i tell ppl that their mustang is capable of doin more with less than wut most think they can.

u just have to understand the pcms.... and know how to take advantage of the low compression stock heads which is your best buddy under boost conditions.
There's the key "understanding the PCM/ECU" and what it is capable of.


I can't locate those articles, I guess they don't go back that far online.


I know you are joking about the larger injectors, but yes they do make me "feel" better, because I can use math and known formulas to prove they can supply enough fuel.
I'm just weird like that. I have to prove or be able to see for myself that something will work.


Some people who have money will just throw cash at a car until it works.
We, on the other hand cannot afford to do that, so we spend countless hours fabbing, trying and researching our mods. In the end we definitely better understand how it works and performs. BUT! it sure would be nice to be able to try that other approach to problems eh?


Thank you for the information and article pointers and as always, I enjoy cussing and discussing with you.

P.S. The guys at AFM, told me the 42's would work, but to be safe I should use the 60's and tune for them.
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Old 03-20-2012, 06:55 PM   #49
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Could somebody tell me if a set of Jr Windsor ported heads would b compatible with my setup i posted above?
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Old 03-20-2012, 10:41 PM   #50
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Re: blowby?

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Could somebody tell me if a set of Jr Windsor ported heads would b compatible with my setup i posted above?
Depends on what size valves are in them and whether or not your pistons are notched for larger valve sizes.
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Old 03-21-2012, 12:55 AM   #51
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I have the speedpro forged pistons and i had the old version of the tfs twisted wedge 170s
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Old 03-21-2012, 07:51 AM   #52
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Re: blowby?

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I have the speedpro forged pistons and i had the old version of the tfs twisted wedge 170s
Stick with the TFS and have them ported. They have the advantage of being lighter and easier to repair if needed.
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