Little underwhelmed with recent dyno numbers. Any suggestions? - Mustang Evolution

Go Back   Mustang Evolution > 1979-2015 Mustang GT || Tech and Talk > 1979-1995 Mustang GT



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them here!
Old 03-14-2016, 08:32 AM   #1
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
Little underwhelmed with recent dyno numbers. Any suggestions?

Hello All,
I recently had my car redynoed with the addition of a Vortech setup and fuel system on my 94GT.
Last year when I had the boltons all put on, I did GT40's and Cobra Intake, Trickflow stage1 cam and a tune and the car was a little underwhelming HP wise. It made 256@301 on a dynojet in the cold weather. I always thought it was the tune, but now on the blower setup with a more known tuners, it made inline with those numbers and again a little underwhelming. This time it made 372@374 on about 10PSI. Weather was probably high 70's this time, so there was likely a bit of heat soak compared to how it was last year this time of year.

I know the heads and intake manifold are holding me back pretty much, but I expected they would atleast break 400 without too much of an issue.
When the cam was installed it was installed straight up dot to dot. The springs I used were Alex Parts springs for the 580 lift cam just in case I went to 1.72 rockers, but Alex stated the seat pressure on these would be ok either way. I ended up going with 1.6 rollers though

So my question is, is there anything relatively easily replaced with little more money in at this point to bump this thing up to over 400whp? I know I can down the pulley a little, but I really expected this to jump more on what it has. Can degreeing the cam at all help? Or just ditch this cam completely?
I know heads and intake will be a huge jump, but I really dont want to rip it all down again right now.

Attached is the dyno sheet and specs on the springs I used for good measure.
Motor and Mods are:
153K mile 302
3Bar GT40's that were refreshed about 1500 miles ago with Alex Parts springs, seals and Scorpion 1.6 rollers and TFS1 cam
FMS shorties, ORH pipe, flowmaster 40's
Anderson Powerpipe with PMAS MH95 on it feeding to a V2SQ. Stock 94-95 Cobra Intake manifold with 70MM throttle body.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Blower dyno sheet.jpg
Views:	69
Size:	55.7 KB
ID:	198213   Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_0517.JPG
Views:	64
Size:	431.9 KB
ID:	198214  

PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 03-14-2016, 09:57 AM   #2
Registered Member
Regular
 
smurf stang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Miami
Region: Florida
Posts: 1,341
Did you verify that it was huffing 10 psi? Didn't see it on the graph.


Also the graph looks good but did they play with timing and fuel?
__________________
2016 VW GTI 2.0 Turbo

1989 Sonic Blue LX Coupe, 349 ci, TW heads, TFS Track Heat Intake, 75mm Accufab TB, 80mm ProM, 30 lb. inj, TKO, 3.73, 31 spline w/ TruTrac, MAC 1-5/8" LT headers w/ H pipe, Flowmaster, electric fan Moates QH
391 rwhp & 424 rwtq...Mustang Dyno 11.5@122mph
smurf stang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-14-2016, 10:29 AM   #3
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
Yea, its a full tune. I trailered it down there because the maf is soo big and the additional bigger fuel stuff I added.
I didnt ask the timing, but he did say it wasnt very conservative. He added a degree in and didnt make much more, and then backed it back out since it didnt liven up much. I want to say maybe 18* of timing, but I cannot be sure on that. Unlike the last tuner, I do trust this one. I didnt bother him much when tuning because I wanted to let him do his thing

I did confirm on the boost gauge, it is seeing about 10psi when I watch it . Not sure if gear loading makes a difference, but I think he said he saw 12 or so PSI at one point. So yea its making boost.
Its the stock 3.3" pulley and has a power pipe and metal pipe for the discharge. I did reuse the upper intake gasket when I had the upper off, but was replaced when I did the heads within the last 1500 miles or so. I guess I can check to see if there is a leak there by chance, but I dont think there is. The car has very good manners other than the lower power. The car did make 116whp and 74ft lbs of tq with the addition of the blower, so I know its doing something.

He did have to tighten the blower belt after the first run, but even with it slipping bad it still made almost 360.
The bottom end seems stout still, but also has 153k miles on it. Compression seemed solid last I checked it. No oil spewing into my oil seperator and I have a check valved breather in the valve cover to avoid too much crank case pressure build up.
To me it seems like more of my "Stock stuff" holding me back, but curious as to if maybe my springs have too much seat pressure or the cam is just wrong for this setup or could use some advance or ****** maybe?
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 03-16-2016, 12:00 PM   #4
Registered Member
Regular
 
smurf stang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Miami
Region: Florida
Posts: 1,341
Maybe excessive belt slip still.


Hard to compare dyno numbers as there are so many variables involved.


Sold some GT40's to a guy I know who paired them up with a ported GT40 intake and and all the other stuff. He was huffing approx. 10 pounds and I think he laid down in the same neighborhood. He did have some belt slip as well. I know when he swapped to TFS heads and Holley intake he gained another 70 horses.
__________________
2016 VW GTI 2.0 Turbo

1989 Sonic Blue LX Coupe, 349 ci, TW heads, TFS Track Heat Intake, 75mm Accufab TB, 80mm ProM, 30 lb. inj, TKO, 3.73, 31 spline w/ TruTrac, MAC 1-5/8" LT headers w/ H pipe, Flowmaster, electric fan Moates QH
391 rwhp & 424 rwtq...Mustang Dyno 11.5@122mph
smurf stang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2016, 12:02 PM   #5
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
He looked like he really tightened the heck out of the belt though. I have the belt off right now because im working on serpentine belt issues right now, but Ill try and tighten it more and see.
Wonder if he just laid timing a little light due to IAT's.
__________________
94 Blown Canary Yellow GT Vert
372WHP/374TQ
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2016, 05:32 PM   #6
Moderator Emeritus
 
Adogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Region: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,499
What are you using for a fuel system?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Mustang Evolution mobile app
__________________
Don't hate....... appreciate
Adogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2016, 07:01 PM   #7
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
Is like to think it's a pretty stout fuel system. I planned for more power so overbuilt.
Walbro gss340 pump, Siemens deka 60's, pmas mh95 slot setup with ba3000 curve, sct chip to take the tune. Otherwise stock lines, stock fpr stock hanger and tank

Fuel deff shouldn't have been the issue
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2016, 07:30 PM   #8
Moderator Emeritus
 
Adogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Region: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,499
If there was an issue he should have seen it, depending on what type of tuning he is doing he would be able to see if there is to much or too little. And make sure the maf voltage is correct for that type of fuel. Did you tell your tuner about the low number?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Mustang Evolution mobile app
__________________
Don't hate....... appreciate
Adogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2016, 07:40 PM   #9
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
He tuned it, so he is very well aware of the numbers.
Not sure I follow where you are going with this?
So is everyone more willing to point the numbers at the tune and not the hardware used? This guy came extremely reccomended so I lean not to believe soo much the tune.
Plus second tuner on second setup and made less than expected
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2016, 11:53 PM   #10
Moderator Emeritus
 
Adogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Region: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,499
Maybe try porting the cobra upper and lower? Maybe that is holding you back

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Mustang Evolution mobile app
__________________
Don't hate....... appreciate
Adogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2016, 06:07 AM   #11
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adogg View Post
Maybe try porting the cobra upper and lower? Maybe that is holding you back

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Mustang Evolution mobile app
Ill just replace it at that point.
__________________
94 Blown Canary Yellow GT Vert
372WHP/374TQ
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2016, 08:25 AM   #12
Moderator Emeritus
 
Adogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Region: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,499
That's true if you port the cobra Intake you get to keep a nice look of that cobra Intake and make more power.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Mustang Evolution mobile app
__________________
Don't hate....... appreciate
Adogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2016, 08:44 AM   #13
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
True, I kind of like that stockish look, but that the price of having someone like TMOSS port it, Im at a new aftermarket piece that I could actually gain from replacing. I didnt port it before because TMOSS said I wouldnt really gain from it on my NA setup. BUt its upwards of $400 + to get it there, ported and sent back to me.
__________________
94 Blown Canary Yellow GT Vert
372WHP/374TQ
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2016, 04:12 PM   #14
Moderator Emeritus
 
Adogg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Region: Massachusetts
Posts: 1,499
Yea for that price not worth it I use the ford box upper on my turbo set up and like it the no runner look

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Mustang Evolution mobile app
__________________
Don't hate....... appreciate
Adogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2016, 11:46 AM   #15
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
So no input on the cam or seat pressure of the springs being an issue maybe? I did tighten the belt more yesterday and it was too tight then as you could hear the blower bearings making a different noise. So I loosened it back up
__________________
94 Blown Canary Yellow GT Vert
372WHP/374TQ
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2016, 01:59 PM   #16
Registered Member
Regular
 
smurf stang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Miami
Region: Florida
Posts: 1,341
For that combo your are around the range in hp. Take it to the track and see what she lays down. How does it run?


Remember dyno's are a tuning tool so don't put ttttoooooo much into the numbers even tho people love throwing numbers around.
__________________
2016 VW GTI 2.0 Turbo

1989 Sonic Blue LX Coupe, 349 ci, TW heads, TFS Track Heat Intake, 75mm Accufab TB, 80mm ProM, 30 lb. inj, TKO, 3.73, 31 spline w/ TruTrac, MAC 1-5/8" LT headers w/ H pipe, Flowmaster, electric fan Moates QH
391 rwhp & 424 rwtq...Mustang Dyno 11.5@122mph
smurf stang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2016, 02:08 PM   #17
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
I mean, it runs like a raped ape. Ill blow off the first few gears by standing on it or rolling burnouts by standing on it. So it goes.
Still gotta get some more seat time and lay into it more on the highway to see how it builds boost in higher gears. I only ever had turbo cars and drove roots style cars and this seems really lazy to build boost in higher gears. Otherwise drives good.
Just got subframe connectors for it and will need some kind of a tire, but I dont expect great times due to traction.
I realize dyno is a tuning tool, but when I got guys telling me Im 50whp short, it concerns me
__________________
94 Blown Canary Yellow GT Vert
372WHP/374TQ
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2016, 02:36 PM   #18
Registered Member
Regular
 
smurf stang's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Miami
Region: Florida
Posts: 1,341
Just to make you feel better as I was tuning my car on the street and then on the dyno we kept getting some disparities. Turns out when I dyno'ed on my drag radials I was consistently lower by about 10 hp and this was on a mustang dyno which usually reads lower. I was alittle bummed till we figured it out but I always felt better after I would run a fast car and beat him. They all would come to me and say "Dayum......how much you spraying?". All I would do is pop the hood and say "Good luck finding any lines". I don't think I ever broke into the 400's on the rollers but love the combo as I was never really building a 347 from the beginning as it went from a 302 H/C/I swap to a 347 build. Thing pulls like a diesel all the way to 6,200. Thing makes over 400 lbs of torque from 3200 to almost 5100.
__________________
2016 VW GTI 2.0 Turbo

1989 Sonic Blue LX Coupe, 349 ci, TW heads, TFS Track Heat Intake, 75mm Accufab TB, 80mm ProM, 30 lb. inj, TKO, 3.73, 31 spline w/ TruTrac, MAC 1-5/8" LT headers w/ H pipe, Flowmaster, electric fan Moates QH
391 rwhp & 424 rwtq...Mustang Dyno 11.5@122mph
smurf stang is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2016, 02:42 PM   #19
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
well what makes it worse is these numbers were STD and not SAE and on a Dynojet and not a Mustang dyno. lol. Id be scare to see the actual numbers. lol
Ill see what it does on the track. Feels borderline rediculous on the street though. But its been awhile since I have driven anything semi fast, so Im sure I will get bored with it after a few weeks or drive time. lol
__________________
94 Blown Canary Yellow GT Vert
372WHP/374TQ
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2016, 10:32 PM   #20
Staff
Regular
Staff
 
scottydsntknow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: JB MDL
Region: New Jersey
Posts: 16,576
Could be a number of things if you are losing power somewhere but if it runs real good... dyno numbers are dyno numbers. Get it down the 1/4 for the only number that actually matters. Plenty of ppl nutswing on dyno slips and then get their doors blown off by somone making less power on paper because of overall setup/driver mod/whatever.

And whoever suggested porting the lower... why? GT40s flow 200cfm, so does the stock lower. Porting the intake without the heads does absolutely nothing and porting GT40s is a complete waste of money unless you are DIY and actually good enough to do it properly for the cost of bits and whatever you feel your time is worth.

Could always throw an intercooler on it and pulley it up a little to get 10 psi after the intercooler with a colder air charge.
__________________
2000 Mustang GT Steeda #0048

Just because I give you advice, doesn't mean I know more than you. Its just means I've done more stupid ****.
scottydsntknow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-22-2016, 12:00 PM   #21
Registered Member
Regular
 
PMPerformance's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Blandon
Region: Pennsylvania
Posts: 30
So I been driving the car around a little more and seeing how hot the IAT's get, I decided to embark on Meth Injection. I have a Devil's own kit coming in next week to play with. Im just gonna try to spray on a small nozzle for cooling and see how it does without the car trying to pull timing with the IAT readings before I get back to the tuner. Not sure I want to lean into the timing much more, but I shall see once I get messing with it.
Also got some NT05's on last weekend and complete world of difference for traction. I see I am not peaking a little more boost than I thought now that I can hook. But dead hook full boost every gear so far, which is a huge improvement over the other tires I had
__________________
94 Blown Canary Yellow GT Vert
372WHP/374TQ
PMPerformance is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Mustang Evolution > 1979-2015 Mustang GT || Tech and Talk > 1979-1995 Mustang GT

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
new dyno numbers maximus 1996-2004 Mustang GT 3 09-07-2007 04:20 AM
Here's my dyno numbers......... 12second5.0 1979-1995 Mustang GT 19 04-08-2006 11:54 PM
r my numbers a little low greg_g70 1996-2004 Mustang GT 27 07-15-2005 07:22 PM
dyno numbers jedwards242000 Pre-2005 V6 Mustang 7 04-17-2005 04:01 PM
Dyno numbers inside from Amazon Racing.. 03redfire cobra The Bar 19 10-27-2004 06:46 PM

» Like Us On Facebook



06:52 PM


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0

MustangEvolution.com is in no way associated with or endorsed by Ford Motor Company.