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Old 07-30-2014, 10:45 AM   #351
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If Ford offers a drag pack, it should have the 6 speed auto as an option with a nice converter right from the factory and the SRA setup out of the S197.

Then again, one could just buy the A6 GT and go from there. It isn't like ppl with A6 Coyotes are having a very difficult time hitting mid 11s or even 10s with bolt ons/tune/some suspension and converter.
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Old 07-30-2014, 11:05 AM   #352
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If cars were meant to be straight line divas, they would come with full spool rear ends. But since they don't... obviously someone, somewhere, decided that they should be able to take a corner going faster than a bicycle.

Any supercharged car with a similar power to weight ratio will perform in a similar fashion down a straight line track. However, you drop 1000# (and 200rwhp), you get a car that can take 90 degree corners in excess of 60mph... like the C6 Z06.

Yes, I know, apples to oranges comparison, but my point is that less weight and better handling trumps massive horsepower and straight line performance... in my opinion.
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Old 07-30-2014, 11:13 AM   #353
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Straight line is where it's at,
For me I could care less about turning. My car is set up for straight dig/roll

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Old 07-30-2014, 11:13 AM   #354
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And this is why its so good to be into cars right now. You can have pretty much anything you want these days. You want a straight line monster, you can get it. You want a car that'll keep up with even some supercars, you can get that too. There is no correct vehicle for everyone.
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Old 07-30-2014, 11:33 AM   #355
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And this is why its so good to be into cars right now. You can have pretty much anything you want these days. You want a straight line monster, you can get it. You want a car that'll keep up with even some supercars, you can get that too. There is no correct vehicle for everyone.
This is true. The factory offerings today, and the aftermarket/technology available to us is incredible. With the aftermarket support a lot of the cars out there have, you can make just about any car perform exactly how you want it. It's a good time to be a gearhead, ladies and gentlemen.
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Old 07-30-2014, 01:39 PM   #356
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And this is why its so good to be into cars right now. You can have pretty much anything you want these days. You want a straight line monster, you can get it. You want a car that'll keep up with even some supercars, you can get that too. There is no correct vehicle for everyone.


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Old 07-30-2014, 01:44 PM   #357
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Still for me looks is 90% of the equation , hp , handling is secondary and I'm not totally sold on the S550 I mean it's not bad but not great either , I just don't like the euro flavour or should I say fusion flavour. Just like in the 60's and early 70's not all years looked that good some of course became classics.
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Old 07-30-2014, 01:52 PM   #358
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Can't find the Top Gear article, but they spoke of how well it handles turns. Not for its size, rather just how well it does it.

TG dislikes US cars, and chryslers almost as much as me. If they say it handles a turn well, it has to be good. Seriously, I detest the chrysler corporation, but they made an excellent product here- disregarding reliability at this point.

searching; seriously, someone else has probably asked before.
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Old 07-30-2014, 02:04 PM   #359
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Still for me looks is 90% of the equation , hp , handling is secondary and I'm not totally sold on the S550 I mean it's not bad but not great either , I just don't like the euro flavour or should I say fusion flavour. Just like in the 60's and early 70's not all years looked that good some of course became classics.

To me looks is know where near 90% I mean it's nice to have a good looking car but if it does not give me the adrenaline rush I am looking for driving it it's not worth my time. going fast the sound of the engine the feeling of the car all adds up to that. If it does not handle worth **** and looks good sitting on a show room floor I look at it I'll like things about it but I won't respect it


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Old 07-30-2014, 02:32 PM   #360
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To me looks is know where near 90% I mean it's nice to have a good looking car but if it does not give me the adrenaline rush I am looking for driving it it's not worth my time. going fast the sound of the engine the feeling of the car all adds up to that. If it does not handle worth **** and looks good sitting on a show room floor I look at it I'll like things about it but I won't respect it


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I'm not talking a 4 cylinder Mustang II , of course reasonable performance in the 500 Hp range , but if you just have a DD do you really need IRS ??? to get some grocery's or a six pack of beer ? like I said everyone has different taste , preferences , and what they like to do with the car .

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Old 07-30-2014, 03:19 PM   #361
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Form follows function. Period. You can have the nicest, sexiest car in existence, but if it can't outperform a civic, then your car isn't better than a civic. The merit and value of a car's worth is based on its performance. Part of performance is handling. You can have the highest top speed, or the quickest acceleration, but if it doesn't handle well, it doesn't perform well. Limiting the design of a car to looks or top speed is an incomplete design, and in my book, it holds no weight. Balancing all functions of performance (top speed, acceleration, handling, reliability) and still producing an aesthetically pleasing car takes true talent. And in today's market, we should accept no less.

That being said, the Hellcat has been tested in the turns, and while not the best, it is said to be tame and predictable. Predictability is good. Consistency allows a driver to learn that platform and become better using it. A good driver can make up a lot of time with a car as fast as the Hellcat.
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Old 07-30-2014, 03:23 PM   #362
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Form follows function. Period. You can have the nicest, sexiest car in existence, but if it can't outperform a civic, then your car isn't better than a civic. The merit and value of a car's worth is based on its performance. Part of performance is handling. You can have the highest top speed, or the quickest acceleration, but if it doesn't handle well, it doesn't perform well. Limiting the design of a car to looks or top speed is an incomplete design, and in my book, it holds no weight. Balancing all functions of performance (top speed, acceleration, handling, reliability) and still producing an aesthetically pleasing car takes true talent. And in today's market, we should accept no less.

That being said, the Hellcat has been tested in the turns, and while not the best, it is said to be tame and predictable. Predictability is good. Consistency allows a driver to learn that platform and become better using it. A good driver can make up a lot of time with a car as fast as the Hellcat.
Not true to all platforms.

When someone builds there car for straight line speed/ acceleration, then that was what it was intended for. Not for cutting corners. Or handling.
Handling for straight line that it

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Old 07-30-2014, 03:37 PM   #363
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Having a good looking car that doesn't perform is like having a good looking woman who doesn't put out. That being said, when someone builds a car for straight line speed, it looks like this:
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Old 07-30-2014, 03:53 PM   #364
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Having a good looking car that doesn't perform is like having a good looking woman who doesn't put out. That being said, when someone builds a car for straight line speed, it looks like this:
No... a good looking car that doesn't perform is not like a good looking woman who doesn't put out. Its more like a good looking woman who doesn't fork like a porn star in bed (or kitchen table or couch or backyard or etc...).

I'd still date her and even marry that down to earth bombshell.

Lol and so a car made to take corners look like this. Click image for larger version

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Why are we comparing such extreme examples of what performance cars are "supposed" to be?
Hell why are we off topic yet again?
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Old 07-30-2014, 03:54 PM   #365
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Having a good looking car that doesn't perform is like having a good looking woman who doesn't put out. That being said, when someone builds a car for straight line speed, it looks like this:
Wrong again.


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Old 07-30-2014, 04:01 PM   #366
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Can we just agree that some people like straight line racing and others like corners?

There is no "better" type, it's all opinion.


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Old 07-30-2014, 04:11 PM   #367
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Can we just agree that some people like straight line racing and others like corners?

There is no "better" type, it's all opinion.


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Yes,

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Old 07-30-2014, 04:25 PM   #368
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Good thing the majority of the world likes corners lol jk


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Old 07-30-2014, 04:30 PM   #369
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Good thing the majority of the world likes corners lol jk


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Lol.
People and there dam straight line cars.

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Old 07-30-2014, 05:18 PM   #370
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Can we just agree that some people like straight line racing and others like corners?

There is no "better" type, it's all opinion.


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Agree? Never. Comparing extremes is pointless. And I guess arguing whether or not the Hellcat can be considered a success, even though it's only talent is straight line racing, ultimately dependent on the intent of the pony car. Were/are pony cars intended to only be used for drag racing? If this is a pony car war, the car(s) need to be judged according to the purpose of the pony car, right? Anyone have a definition of the pony car that states intent?
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Old 07-30-2014, 05:22 PM   #371
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2015 challenger hellcat 707 hp

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Agree? Never. Comparing extremes is pointless. And I guess arguing whether or not the Hellcat can be considered a success, even though it's only talent is straight line racing, ultimately dependent on the intent of the pony car. Were/are pony cars intended to only be used for drag racing? If this is a pony car war, the car(s) need to be judged according to the purpose of the pony car, right? Anyone have a definition of the pony car that states intent?

In this new car world there is no "intent" for any car. Look at the Z28, it corners amazingly, even though it's a Camaro (pony car). Lowered trucks?

You buy a car you want and build it how you want.


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Old 07-30-2014, 05:43 PM   #372
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The original intent is what he was asking for I believe and If I remember right cuz I am to lazy to check my sources is they were designed and a American version of a European sports car for afforedability there were also involved in races like the gran Prix or something like that


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Old 07-30-2014, 06:05 PM   #373
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Good thing the majority of the world likes corners lol jk


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Oh so that's why all the ricers are running around with ridiculous camber and the little billet autozone hook thingers poking out from their bumpers...

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Old 07-30-2014, 06:25 PM   #374
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Oh so that's why all the ricers are running around with ridiculous camber and the little billet autozone hook thingers poking out from their bumpers...


Probably. They just don't know what the **** actually helps with cornering lol


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Old 07-30-2014, 06:49 PM   #375
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We'll never agree collectively. But bringing up the "perfectly" balanced car in my eyes is something along the lines of Porsche or Ferrari, but I'm not a doctor, and I still have yet to come up with a hit song better than Devo so I must settle for something along the lines of what the big 3 have to offer, or buy an older previously violated piece of German or Italian engineering, which at that point will start to cost rediculous amounts of money to maintain.

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Old 07-30-2014, 06:56 PM   #376
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We'll never agree collectively. But bringing up the "perfectly" balanced car in my eyes is something along the lines of Porsche or Ferrari, but I'm not a doctor, and I still have yet to come up with a hit song better than Devo so I must settle for something along the lines of what the big 3 have to offer, or buy an older previously violated piece of German or Italian engineering, which at that point will start to cost rediculous amounts of money to maintain.

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Audi R8. I was never a fan myself until my last autocross an R8 (Quattro) showed up with nothing but slicks on all 4 corners and raped everyone else. And they are fairly affordable for their "status".


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Old 07-30-2014, 07:05 PM   #377
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Audi R8. I was never a fan myself until my last autocross an R8 (Quattro) showed up with nothing but slicks on all 4 corners and raped everyone else. And they are fairly affordable for their "status".


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Yeah but BUT it doesn't have a galloping horse on the front so blah..... no good
in my eyes. What's good with the mustangs is you can customize them to your taste would you customize a R8 not likely , make the car your own ... unique
like the driver all the aftermarket parts for the mustang are amazing , I bet no car has as many.

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Old 07-30-2014, 07:07 PM   #378
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Yes,

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Yes agreed.
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Old 07-30-2014, 07:20 PM   #379
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I would customize any car I own. So yea if I owned an R8 I would.


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I'd definitely find some ways to customize an R8. Although, they are bad *** as is.
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Old 07-30-2014, 07:31 PM   #380
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Good old wiki defines the pony car as such:
The term describes an affordable, compact, highly styled car with a sporty or performance-oriented image.

So, I can't believe I'm saying this, but it looks like Glad was right... it is 90% image. Performance takes a back seat to a sporty image. Bummer.

Granted, none of the cars we have discussed in this thread follow that definition... at all. Affordable? To who? All these cars are $50,000 or more. Compact? Yeah, compared to a semi-truck.

Too bad that R8 is twice the price of the Hellcat... in that respect maybe the modern pony car still can be considered affordable.
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Old 07-30-2014, 08:38 PM   #381
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Good old wiki defines the pony car as such:
The term describes an affordable, compact, highly styled car with a sporty or performance-oriented image.

So, I can't believe I'm saying this, but it looks like Glad was right... it is 90% image. Performance takes a back seat to a sporty image. Bummer.

Granted, none of the cars we have discussed in this thread follow that definition... at all. Affordable? To who? All these cars are $50,000 or more. Compact? Yeah, compared to a semi-truck.

Too bad that R8 is twice the price of the Hellcat... in that respect maybe the modern pony car still can be considered affordable.


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Old 07-30-2014, 08:43 PM   #382
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Hilarious.
The R8 has a hell of a long way to go before it has the heritage of any of the American models that we've been talking about. I'll bet they're not anywhere near as passionate about their cars on the R8 forums as we are here.

That WIKI definition of Pony cars sounds about right. By todays standards, the "compact" part doesn't really apply anymore. Hate to say it but nobody that I'm aware of, who has posted on this thread, has what I would define as a muscle car. We all have Pony cars. Some of us have Hot Rod Pony cars but they are still just pony cars.
It used to be that the muscle cars were the smaller model cars with the big block engines shoehorned into them, and not much else... No heater, no radio, no air, nothing. In the 60's pony cars, it was just the big block engine equipped cars, with a few select small blocks, that were considered the true muscle cars.
Nowadays, everyone that sees a "Dukes of Hazzard" Charger thinks that it is a muscle car. Only a select few could be considered a true muscle car and you don't see them around very often anymore.
Times change and so our definition must also make adjustments. I don't see how anyone can disagree that the Hellcat, the former GT500, and the Z28 are all modern day equivalents of the factory muscle car.
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Old 07-30-2014, 09:01 PM   #383
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Hilarious.
The R8 has a hell of a long way to go before it has the heritage of any of the American models that we've been talking about. I'll bet they're not anywhere near as passionate about their cars on the R8 forums as we are here.

That WIKI definition of Pony cars sounds about right. By todays standards, the "compact" part doesn't really apply anymore. Hate to say it but nobody that I'm aware of, who has posted on this thread, has what I would define as a muscle car. We all have Pony cars. Some of us have Hot Rod Pony cars but they are still just pony cars.
It used to be that the muscle cars were the smaller model cars with the big block engines shoehorned into them, and not much else... No heater, no radio, no air, nothing. In the 60's pony cars, it was just the big block engine equipped cars, with a few select small blocks, that were considered the true muscle cars.
Nowadays, everyone that sees a "Dukes of Hazzard" Charger thinks that it is a muscle car. Only a select few could be considered a true muscle car and you don't see them around very often anymore.
Times change and so our definition must also make adjustments. I don't see how anyone can disagree that the Hellcat, the former GT500, and the Z28 are all modern day equivalents of the factory muscle car.


True the R8 has no heritage at all , the mustang has plenty more comparable would be a Porsche lots of history , but I think mustang fans / owners are the most passionate of the bunch no question . I like Porsche but let's be realistic nothing beats the sound of a V8 especially an American V8.
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Old 07-30-2014, 09:27 PM   #384
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Audi R8. I was never a fan myself until my last autocross an R8 (Quattro) showed up with nothing but slicks on all 4 corners and raped everyone else. And they are fairly affordable for their "status".


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I remember my first run in with one of those (2008 I believe). Sadly it was the V8 and wasn't powered by an LSx. My car was. He bought me Steak and Shake after losing badly that night and actually let me drive his car. It was nice I have to say. The gated shifter was damn cool. Seriously though, a C5 Z06 performance wise, is a much better car in every aspect.

I heard the newer V10 is quite different though and handles very well.
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Old 07-30-2014, 09:31 PM   #385
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I remember my first run in with one of those (2008 I believe). Sadly it was the V8 and wasn't powered by an LSx. My car was. He bought me Steak and Shake after losing badly that night and actually let me drive his car. It was nice I have to say. The gated shifter was damn cool. Seriously though, a C5 Z06 performance wise, is a much better car in every aspect.



I heard the newer V10 is quite different though and handles very well.

Yea it was the newer V10 AWD that I saw run at the Autocross, did pretty damn well. I wouldn't get one if I was concerned with just straight line driving. Good car but definitely not one built for your type of racing.


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