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Old 01-17-2012, 01:00 AM   #1
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78mm throttle body too big?

I have an 02 GT that is all stock besides CAI and exhaust. I also have a tuner. I'm about to put a 78 mm TB on it, but someone said that if you get too big of a TB without supporting mods, it won't help your HP. Is this true?
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Old 01-17-2012, 06:10 AM   #2
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It is true, id get some headers and a midpipe so your car breathes better first, the tb will burn gas faster and u wanna make sure it can get rid of exhaust easily
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Old 01-17-2012, 07:32 AM   #3
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Re: 78mm throttle body too big?

I've also heard that. If your interest is purly for a change in feel/performance, then look at Rear End Gear changes.
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Old 01-17-2012, 09:03 AM   #4
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A 78mm will net you about the same as a 70mm will on a NA motor!.. If you are planning on going FI later on down the road then go with the 78mm!.. And if it is the one from BBK then it will also look good to!..
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Old 01-17-2012, 11:49 AM   #5
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Re: 78mm throttle body too big?

78mm will actually net you less than a 70mm on a stock engine. Air intake isnt just about volume, its about velocity too.
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:13 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CodyNelson
78mm will actually net you less than a 70mm on a stock engine. Air intake isnt just about volume, its about velocity too.
Actually it won't really net you any less!.. The velocity you are speaking of is actually generated in the intake manifold!.. Not the TB!...
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:22 PM   #7
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Re: 78mm throttle body too big?

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Originally Posted by Eturner View Post
Actually it won't really net you any less!.. The velocity you are speaking of is actually generated in the intake manifold!.. Not the TB!...
If the air isnt flowing through the TB it wont get to intake manifold... so TB has alot to do with it
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:32 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CodyNelson

If the air isnt flowing through the TB it wont get to intake manifold... so TB has alot to do with it
I agree with that!.. But the TB is like a doorway!.. Velocity has to do with how fast the air is moving!.. Your intake manifold creates that!..

Both the new 5.0 and BOSS share the same TB yet the BOSS has more hp!.. The main difference in the two is the intake manifold!.. The volume, shape, and runner length of the BOSS helps create it's 444hp vs 414hp!...
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Old 01-17-2012, 12:52 PM   #9
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Well I did replace my intake manifold with a Ford Racing Performance Intake Manifold.
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:03 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by 02Mustang
Well I did replace my intake manifold with a Ford Racing Performance Intake Manifold.
Unless I'm mistaken that is pretty much a factory replacement!..
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Old 01-17-2012, 01:37 PM   #11
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Re: 78mm throttle body too big?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eturner View Post
I agree with that!.. But the TB is like a doorway!.. Velocity has to do with how fast the air is moving!.. Your intake manifold creates that!..

Both the new 5.0 and BOSS share the same TB yet the BOSS has more hp!.. The main difference in the two is the intake manifold!.. The volume, shape, and runner length of the BOSS helps create it's 444hp vs 414hp!...
Too big of a tb will cause it to lose velocity before the air enters the intake manifold.
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Old 01-17-2012, 02:00 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 93slowstang

Too big of a tb will cause it to lose velocity before the air enters the intake manifold.
The TB is a choke point!.. Lol. It is like a doorway!.. Lol. If what you are saying is true then why not put a smaller one on then what the factory has?... The TB has nothing to do with the velocity of the incoming air!.. The velocity of the incoming air is actually created by the intake manifold!.. Not the TB!...

Yes too big of a TB will not net you anymore gains on a NA motor than a 70mm one will!.. But you will not lose any either!.. Sorry but I've read to many comparisons on this and they all came out the same!.. On a FI motor then the bigger TB will net you a much better gain due to the fact that the intake is not being choked!.. Like I stated before the TB is a choke point!..
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Old 01-17-2012, 03:44 PM   #13
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Re: 78mm throttle body too big?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eturner View Post
The TB is a choke point!.. Lol. It is like a doorway!.. Lol. If what you are saying is true then why not put a smaller one on then what the factory has?... The TB has nothing to do with the velocity of the incoming air!.. The velocity of the incoming air is actually created by the intake manifold!.. Not the TB!...

Yes too big of a TB will not net you anymore gains on a NA motor than a 70mm one will!.. But you will not lose any either!.. Sorry but I've read to many comparisons on this and they all came out the same!.. On a FI motor then the bigger TB will net you a much better gain due to the fact that the intake is not being choked!.. Like I stated before the TB is a choke point!..
Yes a 78 is capable of supplying more air than the 70 with a FI car, but his car is almost stock. Obviously too small of a tb will choke the motor down but too big will cause turbulence in the intake manifold. Its not just the manifold that creates velocity it is the entire system that does so. If you haven't noticed all the components gradually get smaller (choking as you put it) as it reaches the engine.
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Old 01-17-2012, 03:49 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 93slowstang

Yes a 78 is capable of supplying more air than the 70 with a FI car, but his car is almost stock. Obviously too small of a tb will choke the motor down but too big will cause turbulence in the intake manifold. Its not just the manifold that creates velocity it is the entire system that does so. If you haven't noticed all the components gradually get smaller (choking as you put it) as it reaches the engine.
I understand what your saying but your still wrong!.. The velocity is only due to the intake manifold!.. Not the TB!...
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Old 01-17-2012, 04:41 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eturner

I understand what your saying but your still wrong!.. The velocity is only due to the intake manifold!.. Not the TB!...
If that were the case then there should be one generic size maf and throttle body, and my civic would be running an 80 mm tb because as you are stating it only the intake manifold controls it velocity. It doesn't quite work like that.
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Old 01-17-2012, 07:33 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 93slowstang

If that were the case then there should be one generic size maf and throttle body, and my civic would be running an 80 mm tb because as you are stating it only the intake manifold controls it velocity. It doesn't quite work like that.
Actually that is how it works!.. Do some actual research on it!... And what some thing comes with in stock form is different than building up some thing for performance!.. Take a look at the TB on the new 5.0!.. Or how about the 2004 Mach1?... Both are NA motors and are bigger than what is on our GTs!.. And that is from the factory!.. So explain that one to me!...
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Old 01-17-2012, 07:41 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eturner

Actually that is how it works!.. Do some actual research on it!... And what some thing comes with in stock form is different than building up some thing for performance!.. Take a look at the TB on the new 5.0!.. Or how about the 2004 Mach1?... Both are NA motors and are bigger than what is on our GTs!.. And that is from the factory!.. So explain that one to me!...
Yep comparing different motors with their tb sizes. A 2v doesnt have near the needs of a 4v 4.6 or 5.0 and uses a smaller tb accordingly. I have done plenty research and fully understand how a Complete intake system works.
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Old 01-17-2012, 07:59 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 93slowstang

Yep comparing different motors with their tb sizes. A 2v doesnt have near the needs of a 4v 4.6 or 5.0 and uses a smaller tb accordingly. I have done plenty research and fully understand how a Complete intake system works.
How about the new 5.0 vs the BOSS?... Both use the exact same size TB!... Yet the BOSS has more hp!.. Doesn't there for require more air than the 5.0?..

Yes there does come a point were a larger TB will not get you any more gains over a smaller one!... But it's not going to cause you to lose any either!.. Ya I've done my research too!... The TB is a choke point!.. Not a velocity point!..

And if the TB was part of your intakes velocity, then why does a bigger, say 80mm TB, work better than a, say 70mm TB, in a Forced Induction setup?.. Wouldn't you want that same amount of velocity that the TB creates?..
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Old 01-17-2012, 08:18 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eturner

How about the new 5.0 vs the BOSS?... Both use the exact same size TB!... Yet the BOSS has more hp!.. Doesn't there for require more air than the 5.0?..

Yes there does come a point were a larger TB will not get you any more gains over a smaller one!... But it's not going to cause you to lose any either!.. Ya I've done my research too!... The TB is a choke point!.. Not a velocity point!..

And if the TB was part of your intakes velocity, then why does a bigger, say 80mm TB, work better than a, say 70mm TB, in a Forced Induction setup?.. Wouldn't you want that same amount of velocity that the TB creates?..
Forced induction cars don't rely on velocity like a N/A car does so the airflow capacity of a larger tb helps.

There's more than the intake that helps the Boss achieve more hp. If it helped soooooo much to have a bigger tb like you have been saying then the boss would have a bigger tb more than likely. There is obviously a reason that professionals say don't use too large of a tb.
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Old 01-17-2012, 08:39 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 93slowstang

Forced induction cars don't rely on velocity like a N/A car does so the airflow capacity of a larger tb helps.

There's more than the intake that helps the Boss achieve more hp. If it helped soooooo much to have a bigger tb like you have been saying then the boss would have a bigger tb more than likely. There is obviously a reason that professionals say don't use too large of a tb.
What I've been saying is that yes a larger TB will net you some gains!.. But!!... 75mm will net you the same gains as a 70mm will on a NA motor!.. If you are planing on going FI then get the 78mm one as it will give you the same gains as the 70mm will now!.. And later down the road when you get that SC or turbo your gains will be even better than if you got the 70mm one!..
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