Replace 4.6 & tranny 97 GT? - Mustang Evolution

Go Back   Mustang Evolution > 1979-2015 Mustang GT || Tech and Talk > 1996-2004 Mustang GT



Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about them here!
Old 08-19-2014, 03:00 PM   #1
Registered User
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: NC/ Cary
Region: North Carolina
Posts: 6
Replace 4.6 & tranny 97 GT?

Does it make any sense at all to replace a 4.6 w/auto trans. (when either dies) with more power and manual trans. in a '97 GT? I'm the original owner and love this car, but would like more muscle. Suggestions? Thanks.
Mitchet4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-19-2014, 03:43 PM   #2
Registered Member
Regular
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Salinas
Region: California
Posts: 7,418
Of course it makes sense if you have taken care of and loved the car for 17+ years.

The first thing that I would do is the PI swap. That will really wake up your engine.
It is just using the heads, cams, and intake manifold from the 99 and later engines on your earlier non-PI engine.
straybullitt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2014, 03:57 PM   #3
Registered User
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: NC/ Cary
Region: North Carolina
Posts: 6
Thanks, but

This car has 266k, uses oil, and the tranny's been worked on twice, so it sounds like maybe a crate short block with the PI swap components, or an upgraded crate engine? . What about the tranny change- am I opening up a can of worms with that? Computer issues? Thanks again.
Mitchet4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-19-2014, 04:22 PM   #4
Registered Member
Regular
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Salinas
Region: California
Posts: 7,418
Haha.
Yes, it sounds like a complete rebuild is in order.
Yeah, look into the crate engines or you may be able to find a complete engine and manual transmission out of a wrecked car. I'd upgrade to a TR3650.
I've seen a couple of complete 03-04 Cobra drivetrains on Craigslist lately.

I'm not sure about the computer. I can't remember if you need to swap to a "manual trans computer" if going from auto to manual trans.
Someone who knows for sure will chime in...
straybullitt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2014, 06:07 PM   #5
Registered Member
Regular
 
99_GRUMPY_GT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Cabo Rojo, P.R.
Region: Other
Posts: 590
The transmission mounts are the same, so that can be reused. The driveshaft is different, the length is the same I beleive, it is the yokes that are different, so you would need a manual driveshaft. You would need the whole manual pedal assembly, clutch quadrant and cable. Then you would need to get rid of the auto kickdown cable, get a flywheel to replace the auto flexplate, a new clutch to replace the torque converter. You would also need the center bezel trim and boot for the manual shifter, plus the shifter itself. Finally, you would need to eliminate the wiring for the auto trans, and use the 5spd harness. And replace the auto ECU (which will be looking for signals from the transmission and trying to shift it) with a manual ECU. Now some will say just have your ECU flashed to work with a manual trans instead of the auto, and that is if you can get the P.A.T.S. system worked out. If you fail to get the P.A.T.S. worked out, once you try to start the car, it will think it is stolen and then it is O NO YOU GO!!! The 96-97 mustang gt's have the P.A.T.S.-passive alarm in the dash cluster, 98 mustang gt has it in the pcm. This is very important for this swap. If you try to use the existing ECU then you will go directly into LIMP mode. FORD will not flash or reprogram a ECU for you, it is a legality issue with emission control database and all that crap. You would have to have a tuner shop do that if you go that route. But it is just simpler to get a ECU out of a manual trans equipted car.
__________________


2015 Race Red Performance Package GT 5.0 (435hp) stock
Still in the making Updates coming soon!
99_GRUMPY_GT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2014, 06:52 PM   #6
Registered Member
Regular
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Salinas
Region: California
Posts: 7,418
You're old like me Grumpy...


These cars don't have a speedometer cable. Information is gathered through a speed sensor and sent to the speedometer electronically.
straybullitt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2014, 07:00 PM   #7
Registered Member
Regular
 
99_GRUMPY_GT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Cabo Rojo, P.R.
Region: Other
Posts: 590
Quote:
Originally Posted by straybullitt View Post
You're old like me Grumpy...


These cars don't have a speedometer cable. Information is gathered through a speed sensor and sent to the speedometer electronically.

I have worked on soooo many different applications in my past, and if my memory pills and geratol is forgotten, I forget I am married.

You know how it is, you get to rambling and do not know when to stop. I deleted that last sentence. Thanks OLD MAN!
__________________


2015 Race Red Performance Package GT 5.0 (435hp) stock
Still in the making Updates coming soon!
99_GRUMPY_GT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-19-2014, 07:13 PM   #8
Registered Member
Regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: 00
Region: Other
Posts: 1,198
[QUOTE=Mitchet4;2069039]Does it make any sense at all to replace a 4.6 w/auto trans. (when either dies) with more power and manual trans. in a '97 GT? I'm the original owner and love this car, but would like more muscle. Suggestions?


I installed an 01gt engine into my old 96gt. It's almost an 100% plug and play.( Few minor mods). You probably can shop around a lil and find a good low-decent mileage engine from 03-04. To keep things simple I would stay with the automatic and build your aode or try to find a 4r7w from a wrecked 98gt. The 5 speed is fun but the automatic can be as well with the right build and torque converter.
Bigshow14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2014, 09:58 AM   #9
Staff
Regular
Staff
 
scottydsntknow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: JB MDL
Region: New Jersey
Posts: 16,606
I'd find a lower mileage PI motor and drop it in. Its a direct drop and all the NPI electronics work just fine. My 98 has a 99 motor in it with the 98 timing cover and 04 Romeo heads and is run just fine by the stock 98 wiring/tune.

As far as the auto... I believe there was a sensor change in 98 for the HARD harness but I'm not quite sure. Click Click Racing - Click Click Racing will probably have that info.

I would stick with the auto personally. 4r70ws are everywhere and CHEAP. An even better option is the 04 trans since you need to get the ECU tuned anyway. The 04 transmissions (4r75w) are much stronger and only require changing the OSS pulse setting in the ECU to work in a 4r70w car. Also, in the end the auto will be much faster down the 1/4 if setup properly. Make sure you put a good converter in while the car is apart as well. Since yours has super high mileage on it, you need to anyway and replacing with a stock one is an effort in futility.

One last thing, make SURE your frame/body is up to par for spending the $$$ and doing the work. I see WAY too many cars with a lot of work done and then see rot all over the place. You honestly might be better off selling what you have or parting it out for some $$$ and then just buying a 99-04 GT with much lower miles and in whatever configuration you want.
__________________
2000 Mustang GT Steeda #0048

Just because I give you advice, doesn't mean I know more than you. Its just means I've done more stupid ****.
scottydsntknow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2014, 03:34 PM   #10
Registered User
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: NC/ Cary
Region: North Carolina
Posts: 6
good advice

Thanks guys, this car is in great shape otherwise, garage kept, and I'm really attached to it, so I'll likely upgrade the engine.. but the tranny is another issue for sure. Biggest mistake I made in '97 was not saving the $800 and getting the 5 speed.. they were identical and side by side. Kicked myself ever since. Thanks again.
Mitchet4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2014, 04:22 PM   #11
Registered Member
Regular
 
99_GRUMPY_GT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Cabo Rojo, P.R.
Region: Other
Posts: 590
Keep us up to date on your progress and anything we can do to help you on the forum.
__________________


2015 Race Red Performance Package GT 5.0 (435hp) stock
Still in the making Updates coming soon!
99_GRUMPY_GT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-2014, 09:57 PM   #12
Registered Member
Regular
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: 00
Region: Other
Posts: 1,198
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mitchet4 View Post
Thanks guys, this car is in great shape otherwise, garage kept, and I'm really attached to it, so I'll likely upgrade the engine.. but the tranny is another issue for sure. Biggest mistake I made in '97 was not saving the $800 and getting the 5 speed.. they were identical and side by side. Kicked myself ever since. Thanks again.
Lol the auto wasnt a bad choice, what gear option did it come with, 3.08,3.27. Post some pics of your car when you get time
Bigshow14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-2014, 06:42 AM   #13
Staff
Regular
Staff
 
scottydsntknow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: JB MDL
Region: New Jersey
Posts: 16,606
Some of the later 97 models got the better updated "98-03" 4R70w. If the case says F7 on it then its the newer one, but would still need rebuilt at this mileage. I'd just get a silverfox 4R with a nice triple disc stall for the trans and find a PI motor in the JY in good shape, drop in and go. Or if you are on more of a budget, try a low mileage 2004 transmission with a single disc Freakshow converter and a tune to firm up the shift points and to get the OSS setting right for the 2004 transmission.

Also, look up the J-MOD for the 4R70w transmissions. Youtube video will show up if you search "J-mod TCCOA" on youtube itself. It is basically a near free "shift kit" that also increases overall transmission longevity.
__________________
2000 Mustang GT Steeda #0048

Just because I give you advice, doesn't mean I know more than you. Its just means I've done more stupid ****.
scottydsntknow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2014, 09:37 PM   #14
Registered Member
Regular
 
thyreaper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 328
Replace 4.6 & tranny 97 GT?

Im not so sure the 96s have the pats in the instrument cluster because i have a separate box that controls the theft stuff in the trunk and also i swapped clusters and did not have an issue with the pats system at all ( mines a 96 ) if someone that knows alot about the pats systems in particular the early ones id like if you shared your knowledge, Mitch if u want a manual and would like to bang on gears then go for it you can get all the parts out of a salvage yard fairly cheap but they are right u will get a code when the ecm doesn't get a signal from the auto trans so swapping to a manual ecu would be the ideal thing id hit up the forums, ebay, craigslist for that, if you like the auto then stick with it and do what they said an auto can be made to be faster then a manual with the right setup but a good torque converter can be pricey, its all in what your goals are with the car and what your heart is set on with that said as soon as we know if u want a manual over a auto or vice versa then we can help you further lol


Sent from my iPhone using Mustang Evolution
thyreaper is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Lower Navigation
Go Back   Mustang Evolution > 1979-2015 Mustang GT || Tech and Talk > 1996-2004 Mustang GT

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Auto tranny VS. Manual tranny x2bittz Classic Mustangs 15 06-29-2013 08:07 PM
How to replace door pins & bushings? 91notchback 1979-1995 Mustang GT 14 02-21-2013 04:05 PM
v6 tranny to a v8 tranny 97V6stangct Pre-2005 V6 Mustang 4 02-04-2012 01:42 PM
im about to replace my clutch/flywheel what else should i replace? 1996v6stang Pre-2005 V6 Mustang 2 07-12-2010 12:22 PM
Replace alternator & Oil leak 1996 Ford Mustang? riordain General Mustang Discussion 3 03-27-2010 03:07 PM

» Like Us On Facebook



11:19 PM


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.6.0

MustangEvolution.com is in no way associated with or endorsed by Ford Motor Company.