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Old 05-20-2013, 08:10 AM   #1
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Alternate to an oil catch can

For an "old school" look, I decided to remove my homemade catch can, and install two oil breather filters, one on each side of the engine. These filters replace the tubes that run the engine crankcase fumes back into the intake, to be burned. It has been shown on this site and many others that the passenger side allows oil mist to enter the upper intake, and this can cause long term oil deposits in the intake and backsides of the valves. One of the members here, Ronnie, has installed an air filter breater replacement for the oil fill cap, so you would only need one filter, the passenger side. However, the drivers side tube is still in place, and the kit (below) removes both of these tubes, removing the possibility of oil mist getting into the intake. Here is what I used which is almost half of what an oil catch can will cost you, and also prevents the oil from getting to your intake:

1) 2011+ GT/Boss Breather Package - Justin's Performance Center

These next items I hade to purchase to get the passenger side filter to clear the upper intake manifold that hangs slightly over the PCV valve that the filter clamps to (replaces the tube that runs to the upper intake):

1) one two and a half piece of 5/8 heater hose
2) One 5/8 brass barbed fitting
3) One additional clamp

As of this writing, JPC is going to include these pieces in their kit, so you will not have to get them.

UPDATE:

In reading about this more (PVC verses breather filters), I have basically killed the ability of my engine to remove it's gases, water vapor, and blowby from the crankcase. I have re-installed the tube/catch can on the passenger side. I left the breather filter on the drivers side, as this side draws in fresh air into the crankcase. So either the stock tube from the air cleaner to the drivers side valve cover, or a simple breather filter on the drivers side valve cover is good. On the passenger side, you want the PVC and a tube from it connected to the intake (existing stock setup). This works off of vacuum at idle, when the intake manifold pressure is higher than the crankcase pressure, allowing for the gas fumes/blowby/water vapor to be drawn from the crankcase, and into the intake to be reburned. Without this tube connected to the intake, and using just a breather filter as I had done, it does not get the gases/blowby out of the crankcase as well, and can contaminate the oil.

So, bottom line, it's alright for a filter on the drivers side, as this is the "intake" side of the PVC system. It draws fresh clean air into the crankcase from this side. On the passenger side, use a tube from the pvc (in the passenger side valve cover) to the intake to allow the crankcase gases/blowby to be reburned. Place a catch can inline with this tube to seperate any of the oil mist within this tube.

Lesson learned.

Here are the pictures of the completed install on the passenger side (drivers side did not require the extension tube mod, so it is not shown; the filter on the drivers side simply clamps onto the tube fitting on the valve cover without an extension needed):
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Old 05-20-2013, 08:23 AM   #2
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Hi Bucko

I did mine this way,
JLT oil catch can on Passenger side.
CFM Breather cap on the drivers side. ( This replaces the oil filler cap and allows the crank case to breath. ) From what I was told by some friends that actually build engines and race that this totally eliminates the oil from foaming in the pan. I was wondering if these did anything at all except look good.

What you have is probably just as good and cheaper.

I love the looks of mine when I pop the hood. It matches up with my CAI perfect.






Ronnie
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Old 05-20-2013, 08:33 AM   #3
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Yep. I thought about the oil breather oil fill method, but it still retains the tube from the drivers side to the intake. Having the filter installed as you do, this is most likely a moog point, but I liked the cleanliness of removing tubes from the covers to the intake tube, and garanteeing that no oil mist is going to get to the intake. The kit mentioned also includes the block off caps that are installed on the intake side (both sides) when the stock tubes are removed.

There's always a couple of "other" mouse traps to be invented! No right or wrong way; just cost effective and/or what pleases the eye of the owner.
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Old 05-20-2013, 08:48 AM   #4
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Hi Bucko

These things have been around for a lot of years. I have seen them used on almost all of the race engines when at the drag strip or circle tracks. If you can remember some of the old cars had the PCV oil tube going into the air cleaners. When putting on the High performance air cleaners you always had to replace the oil cap with a filter. I guess it is a Clean air act type thing that they have the system they use now.

My 69 Z28 came with some goofy air pump that Grumpy Bill removed first when modifying my engine. He was the best in the world for getting the most power out of a Chevy.

Ronnie
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:23 AM   #5
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They look great! Both of them.
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Old 05-20-2013, 10:33 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronnie948 View Post
These things have been around for a lot of years. I have seen them used on almost all of the race engines when at the drag strip or circle tracks. If you can remember some of the old cars had the PCV oil tube going into the air cleaners. When putting on the High performance air cleaners you always had to replace the oil cap with a filter. I guess it is a Clean air act type thing that they have the system they use now.

My 69 Z28 came with some goofy air pump that Grumpy Bill removed first when modifying my engine. He was the best in the world for getting the most power out of a Chevy.

Ronnie
Better than Smokey Yunick? I met him back in the 80's while attending what was then called the Suntrust 24 hours of racing in Daytona. He had an old shop off of 92 there by the track. I still recall the sign he had in the shop...speed costs money. More speed costs more money.

Yes, I do recall my early Vettes and Trans Am's with the breather filter running a tube into the air cleaners over the carb.

We are two old ones Ronnie.
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Old 05-20-2013, 11:30 AM   #7
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Grumpy Bill Jenkins was as good or =Equal

Google Grumpy Bill Jenkins for his information.

I knew Smoky very well. His main truck shop was up on Beach Street near the Halifax river. He Maintained my 79 Kensworth while I had it. His big sign said "THE BEST DAMN GARAGE IN TOWN" He was a fixture in this town. I remember he had a Hudson Hornet that he used to drive around town. It was when Daytona was a small town and where I live in Port Orange was really underpopulated. Those were the very,very good old days that are gone forever.

Getting back on topic, I'll bet not to many on our Forum members are old enough to remember the Corvair Turbo Spider, The Griffith, A Real Shelby Cobra ( Not Replicas) and the long lines to get gas in 1972 that killed the American Car industry FOREVER. It was the best time in history for us Car People. Hell, We even had cool music you could actually listen to without getting a headache.

Valve covers had breather caps, Fumes went into air cleaners, Engines had air pumps, but none had Computers and a million sensors so taking all of the crap off was no problem at all. Removing that stuff just made the car run a lot better.

The country of California had their own standards and the car and Motorcycle manufactures made the cars special to sell in that Country.

Ronnie
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:09 PM   #8
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Off topic, But I started the thread....my old boss had a Corvair Turbo Spider. He told me he drove it home from the dealer. He was on the Jersy turnpike, mad a right turn, but the corvair kept going straight! They (dealer) found that the rear sway bar had to be changed to "push" the front end down at 60 MPH or faster, as the front would lift, raising the tires off the ground. He loved the car, but after the Ralph Nadar "Unsafe at any speed" book came out, the corvair was doomed.

I had a 64 Beetle during those long lines of 1977 during the short supply of gas times. I was paying about 65 cents a gallon, but had to wait my turn in the long lines. The big cars went away, and we got the Pinto, Vega, and Mustang II; and they made a Mustang II cobra edition. Pee youuu!
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Old 05-20-2013, 12:16 PM   #9
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Wow, this sure opened some good memories.

In 1959 I bought a brand new 1959 Fiat 500. I was 16 years old. It got about 50 MPG when gas only cost 25 cents a gallon or sometimes even less. I only kept it a year but it was a fun year.




I was going out with a nice rich girl. Her Father hated me and my old 1947 Dodge oil burner. He paid me $500.00 not to date his daughter anymore. I traded in my Dodge and the $500.00 and drove off in my brand new Fiat 500.

((( i still dated his daughter for a while but could not call her or pick her up at her house))))

Ronnie
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Old 05-20-2013, 03:49 PM   #10
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Would that be you next to the original "500"?
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Old 05-20-2013, 04:17 PM   #11
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Off topic, But I started the thread....my old boss had a Corvair Turbo Spider. He told me he drove it home from the dealer. He was on the Jersy turnpike, mad a right turn, but the corvair kept going straight! They (dealer) found that the rear sway bar had to be changed to "push" the front end down at 60 MPH or faster, as the front would lift, raising the tires off the ground. He loved the car, but after the Ralph Nadar "Unsafe at any speed" book came out, the corvair was doomed.

I had a 64 Beetle during those long lines of 1977 during the short supply of gas times. I was paying about 65 cents a gallon, but had to wait my turn in the long lines. The big cars went away, and we got the Pinto, Vega, and Mustang II; and they made a Mustang II cobra edition. Pee youuu!
Some Guy locally was selling a mustang II cobra shell for 500 haha. But man hearing all this car stories from you guys makes me realize I haven't been through anything LOL I'm 17 with my 2nd car brand new and paid by me myself and I. Love hearing this stories, should start a new thread. Love to hear some more.
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Old 05-20-2013, 04:45 PM   #12
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Yes, That is me at sweet sixteen

The kid with the truck is Bobby Short and he was fifteen. He could only drive the truck in the field across from his house. No License yet. He bought a 1964 Mustang Convertable 6 cyl as soon as he heard they were going to make them. It was ordered and the ugly gold outside with a black inside. As far as I know he still has it. I'll have to track him down the next time I go to Delaware. As you know, The first one's produced were all six cylinders. Then I got mine, I do believe mine was a was a 221 Ci V8 (1964 1/2 ) One of the first with a V8, My 65 Hi-Performance was a 289 271 Horsepower four speed that I had Billy McDoul redo into a GTO/ Hemi killer. He was the one that ran the record breaking F150 truck for Ford Motor Company. I loved my 65 suped up beast but got stupid and got married. Donna could not drive it so I got a 1967 Mustang fully loaded automatic notchback. In 69 Donna had the Mustang so I bought a 69 Z28 and we went to Woodstock then to California, Back across the southern USA to Key west in it. Yes I was at Woodstock. I never dreamed at that time it would get to be the event of a lifetime.
I could go on & on but my one finger typing is making my finger sore.

Ronnie
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Old 05-20-2013, 11:53 PM   #13
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I had this setup on my 06 GT for a 1000 miles until I noticed oil residue all over under the hood coming from the filters... I would suggest not doing this or at least put some sort of baffle inside the filter to stop the oil from shooting out of the filters all over your engine compartment. Their are 2 reasons for the can.. to catch the oil so it doesnt re-enter the intake and to keep the oil from going into the enviroment by dripping out all over your tidy engine compartment and all over the road.. trust me. Hours of cleaning every month.. use the can.
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Old 05-21-2013, 12:47 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by TruChris View Post

Some Guy locally was selling a mustang II cobra shell for 500 haha. But man hearing all this car stories from you guys makes me realize I haven't been through anything LOL I'm 17 with my 2nd car brand new and paid by me myself and I. Love hearing this stories, should start a new thread. Love to hear some more.
Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm simon wei lol

---------- Post added at 11:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:46 PM ----------

You guys are actually really knowledgeable Ronnie and Bucko!
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Old 05-21-2013, 01:23 AM   #15
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For an "old school" look, I decided to remove my homemade catch can, and install two oil breather filters, one on each side of the engine. These filters replace the tubes that run the engine crankcase fumes back into the intake, to be burned. It has been shown on this site and many others that the passenger side allows oil mist to enter the upper intake, and this can cause long term oil deposits in the intake and backsides of the valves. One of the members here, Ronnie, has installed an air filter breater replacement for the oil fill cap, so you would only need one filter, the passenger side. However, the drivers side tube is still in place, and the kit (below) removes both of these tubes, removing the possibility of oil mist getting into the intake. Here is what I used which is almost half of what an oil catch can will cost you, and also prevents the oil from getting to your intake:

1) 2011+ GT/Boss Breather Package - Justin's Performance Center

These next items I hade to purchase to get the passenger side filter to clear the upper intake manifold that hangs slightly over the PCV valve that the filter clamps to (replaces the tube that runs to the upper intake):

1) one two and a half piece of 5/8 heater hose
2) One 5/8 brass barbed fitting
3) One additional clamp

As of this writing, JPC is going to include these pieces in their kit, so you will not have to get them.

Here are the pictures of the completed install on the passenger side (drivers side did not require the extension tube mod, so it is not shown; the filter on the drivers side simply clamps onto the tube fitting on the valve cover without an extension needed):
Would this pass smog in California? Why can't you plug the hole?
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Old 05-21-2013, 01:29 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronnie948 View Post
Google Grumpy Bill Jenkins for his information.

I knew Smoky very well. His main truck shop was up on Beach Street near the Halifax river. He Maintained my 79 Kensworth while I had it. His big sign said "THE BEST DAMN GARAGE IN TOWN" He was a fixture in this town. I remember he had a Hudson Hornet that he used to drive around town. It was when Daytona was a small town and where I live in Port Orange was really underpopulated. Those were the very,very good old days that are gone forever.

Getting back on topic, I'll bet not to many on our Forum members are old enough to remember the Corvair Turbo Spider, The Griffith, A Real Shelby Cobra ( Not Replicas) and the long lines to get gas in 1972 that killed the American Car industry FOREVER. It was the best time in history for us Car People. Hell, We even had cool music you could actually listen to without getting a headache.

Valve covers had breather caps, Fumes went into air cleaners, Engines had air pumps, but none had Computers and a million sensors so taking all of the crap off was no problem at all. Removing that stuff just made the car run a lot better.

The country of California had their own standards and the car and Motorcycle manufactures made the cars special to sell in that Country.

Ronnie
And odd and even gas buying days depending on your license plate.
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Old 05-21-2013, 04:20 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by pwrby4d View Post
I had this setup on my 06 GT for a 1000 miles until I noticed oil residue all over under the hood coming from the filters... I would suggest not doing this or at least put some sort of baffle inside the filter to stop the oil from shooting out of the filters all over your engine compartment. Their are 2 reasons for the can.. to catch the oil so it doesnt re-enter the intake and to keep the oil from going into the enviroment by dripping out all over your tidy engine compartment and all over the road.. trust me. Hours of cleaning every month.. use the can.
The oil reaches the catch can only because there's a vacuum produced by the upper intake, which in turn "pulls' the crankcase fumes/oil mist into the can. Eliminate the vacuum (by replacing the hose with a breather) and you eliminate the oil in a can. However, I am now concerned that the PCV valve may no longer be working on the passenger side, because I eliminated the vacuum when I removed and capped the upper intake tube.

I may put the catch can back until I can do more research on this.

Several folks on another forum have run these filters on their GT's and Boss's, with no oil or film in their engine compartment after several thousand miles.
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Old 05-21-2013, 04:24 AM   #18
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Would this pass smog in California? Why can't you plug the hole?
Don't want to plug the engine valve cover....the engine crankcase needs to breathe (hense the reason for the PCV valve and tube to the intake; to capture the fumes and re-burn them). Unfortunately with a vacuum the intake causes when the tube system is used, it draws oil mist into the intake, which in turn can build up on the backsides of the valves or throttle body. This is why folks use a catch can or a filter arrangement. I'm concerned now that with just a filter, the PCV valve may not be working/opening without the vacuum of the upper intake connection. This requires more digging on my part.
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Old 05-21-2013, 04:26 AM   #19
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Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm simon wei lol

---------- Post added at 11:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:46 PM ----------

You guys are actually really knowledgeable Ronnie and Bucko!
Got to meet Ronnie at a Daytona spring car show. No doubt I'll spend a lot more time with him at some car meets. I look forward to this.
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Old 05-21-2013, 05:37 AM   #20
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Don't want to plug the engine valve cover....the engine crankcase needs to breathe (hense the reason for the PCV valve and tube to the intake; to capture the fumes and re-burn them). Unfortunately with a vacuum the intake causes when the tube system is used, it draws oil mist into the intake, which in turn can build up on the backsides of the valves or throttle body. This is why folks use a catch can or a filter arrangement. I'm concerned now that with just a filter, the PCV valve may not be working/opening without the vacuum of the upper intake connection. This requires more digging on my part.
Thanks. So with the catch can nw often do you need to empty it. And won't oil still be sucked into the intake.
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Old 05-21-2013, 06:05 AM   #21
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Thanks. So with the catch can nw often do you need to empty it. And won't oil still be sucked into the intake.
I check mine once a week, as I have a clear catch can bottle; I can see the amount of oil it traps. It's about two to three table spoons of oil per month. I travel about 1200 to 1500 mules a month.

UPDATE:

In reading about this more (PVC verses breather filters), I have basically killed the ability of my engine to remove it's gases, water vapor, and blowby from the crankcase. I have re-installed the tube/catch can on the passenger side. I left the breather filter on the drivers side, as this side draws in fresh air into the crankcase. So either the stock tube from the air cleaner to the drivers side valve cover, or a simple breather filter on the drivers side valve cover is good. On the passenger side, you want the PVC and a tube from it connected to the intake (existing stock setup). This works off of vacuum at idle, when the intake manifold pressure is higher than the crankcase pressure, allowing for the gas fumes/blowby/water vapor to be drawn from the crankcase, and into the intake to be reburned. Without this tube connected to the intake, and using just a breather filter as I had done, it does not get the gases/blowby out of the crankcase as well, and can contaminate the oil.

So, bottom line, it's alright for a filter on the drivers side, as this is the "intake" side of the PVC system. It draws fresh clean air into the crankcase from this side. On the passenger side, use a tube from the pvc (in the passenger side valve cover) to the intake to allow the crankcase gases/blowby to be reburned. Place a catch can inline with this tube to seperate any of the oil mist within this tube.

Lesson learned.
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Old 05-21-2013, 08:04 AM   #22
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Yes. Oil gets pulled out from vac. But.... Oil also gets thrown from the overhead cams. The inside of the valve covers have a baffle but oil gets past it quite easily. Speaking from experience my friend. Anyway, you got it all right now.
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Old 05-21-2013, 08:08 AM   #23
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Right information Bucko

Putting the filter on the drivers side is a Plus ++ for venting the oil pan. The PCV (Passenger side ) should either be left alone or a catch can installed according to Rick Green ( My Neighbor) He used to build race car engines for Bessette racing. pwrby4d is right. It won't really hurt anything but will allow oil mist to get through the passenger side filter. I left my catch can on and the filter I got for the drivers side actually raises the actual filter farther away from the valve cover. So far I have no oil mist or any residue at all on or inside of my breather cap. I have a slight amount of oil in my catch can but I only went about 500 miles since putting the breather cap on. about 1,000 miles for the catch can.

This is how we learn, Install first-Ask questions later.

Ronnie
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Old 05-21-2013, 09:16 AM   #24
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The pcv will help prevent sludge build up with a catch can installed. Also, If you run boost a pcv valve is a must! If you remove it then you are adding more back pressure at idle and under boost. It is a check valve... Makes sense right? Learned that one a long time ago the hard way too...
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Old 05-21-2013, 09:33 AM   #25
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UpDate on some information

Rick Green not only made the engine for this car,


but he was also a majer Sponsor. I also was a sponsor and it was a super fast car. Those were some great fun days and I think most people that live in the Daytona area probably remember this car and Bassett Racing car # 17.

Ronnie
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2012-candy red- V-6 MCA, Automatic Trans. CFM Valve cover breather. MMD blackTail light trim.Magnaflow axle back street mufflers, JLT oil catch can.MMD hood struts.
Airaid Cold Air intake. red caliper covers, 3.7L performance engine cover, Flat black hood spears.Boss 302 strut brace, CDC rear panel, Trunk Cargo net,--Dash carpet cover,
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Old 05-21-2013, 09:42 AM   #26
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I've been looking for JLT alternative as well. Has anyone tried using this tiny can from JEGS?

Product# 555-52205
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Old 05-21-2013, 10:00 AM   #27
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Here is the product screen shot. Any opinion is appreciated.

Click image for larger version

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Old 05-21-2013, 10:10 AM   #28
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I personally like the JLT

The JLT is complete. It comes with the fittings and hoses to just put it on with no problems. It also has a filter in the top of it to let the can breath without letting any oil slip past it. It is a very well designed item. Top quality all the way.



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2012-candy red- V-6 MCA, Automatic Trans. CFM Valve cover breather. MMD blackTail light trim.Magnaflow axle back street mufflers, JLT oil catch can.MMD hood struts.
Airaid Cold Air intake. red caliper covers, 3.7L performance engine cover, Flat black hood spears.Boss 302 strut brace, CDC rear panel, Trunk Cargo net,--Dash carpet cover,
Viser stickers to cover ugly yellow warning crap,Aluminum driveshafft and Swarr Bar.
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Old 05-21-2013, 10:16 AM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronnie948 View Post
Rick Green not only made the engine for this car,


but he was also a majer Sponsor. I also was a sponsor and it was a super fast car. Those were some great fun days and I think most people that live in the Daytona area probably remember this car and Bassett Racing car # 17.

Ronnie
Wow Suntrust 24 hours of Daytona I bet that was when they were in Florida, and Georgia only. Is Suntrust even a sponsor today. I know since as far as I remember Rolex has been the premier sponsor
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Old 05-21-2013, 10:17 AM   #30
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One JLT cost is 2 of this Jegs. I was thinking of just cutting the stock hose and fitting this can with a clamp.
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Old 05-21-2013, 10:31 AM   #31
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You can do that.

You will have to get to fittings and two clamps. Any parts store can handle these.

I got my JLT from American Muscle and used the Forum Discount. It was around $100.00 or so . The quality and the way it looks is worth the extra $$$ for me.

I also have the stock hose to install if I ever need warranty work done.

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2012-candy red- V-6 MCA, Automatic Trans. CFM Valve cover breather. MMD blackTail light trim.Magnaflow axle back street mufflers, JLT oil catch can.MMD hood struts.
Airaid Cold Air intake. red caliper covers, 3.7L performance engine cover, Flat black hood spears.Boss 302 strut brace, CDC rear panel, Trunk Cargo net,--Dash carpet cover,
Viser stickers to cover ugly yellow warning crap,Aluminum driveshafft and Swarr Bar.
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Old 05-21-2013, 11:41 AM   #32
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Made one simular to that of the Jegs kit Tangsters shows in his pic. Head over to Lowes or Home Depot and buy an air compressor water seperator; same thing.
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Old 05-21-2013, 11:45 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pwrby4d View Post
The pcv will help prevent sludge build up with a catch can installed. Also, If you run boost a pcv valve is a must! If you remove it then you are adding more back pressure at idle and under boost. It is a check valve... Makes sense right? Learned that one a long time ago the hard way too...
I always kept the PCV valve intact....I removed the tube from it that connected it to the air intake and placed the air breather on it (PCV). I have now removed that breather filter, and put back the oil seperator line.

Simply placing a filter on the top of the PCV valve on the valve cover does no purpose after my reading up on it.
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Old 05-21-2013, 02:13 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronnie948 View Post
Rick Green not only made the engine for this car,


but he was also a majer Sponsor. I also was a sponsor and it was a super fast car. Those were some great fun days and I think most people that live in the Daytona area probably remember this car and Bassett Racing car # 17.

Ronnie

Nice!

---------- Post added at 02:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:12 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by bucko View Post
I always kept the PCV valve intact....I removed the tube from it that connected it to the air intake and placed the air breather on it (PCV). I have now removed that breather filter, and put back the oil seperator line.

Simply placing a filter on the top of the PCV valve on the valve cover does no purpose after my reading up on it.
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