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Old 08-21-2014, 01:59 PM   #281
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Lol how is the only guy here who actively tunes wrong? I never said it wouldnt run, but do you understand how a MAF works? Your cars were running incredibly lean going to a different sized MAF from stock without adjusting the tune. Talk to any tuner and they will tell you that. Its common knowledge.

I tuned a car once with a different sized MAF from stock, only 1/2" difference, and it pegged the Fuel trims at 30% and was still running an 18 AFR, but by all means, im the one who doesnt know what the **** IM talking about.
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Old 08-21-2014, 02:10 PM   #282
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Here are 3 MAF curves from cars I myself have personally tuned. 2.5", 3" and 3.5", and you can see they're logarithmic, meaning the further up the curve you go, the larger the discrepancy gets.


Between the 2.5" and 3" at 2.5 Maf volts you're commanding 12% more G/s of fuel


Between the 3" and 3.5" at the same MAF voltage you're commanding about 34% more fuel. Argue with that and tell me I'm wrong. Dumbasses.
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Old 08-21-2014, 02:14 PM   #283
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If you have a performance car on the tune it will work which 95% of people have. It's the same size pipe as most cold air intakes. My car ran a little bit rich which I preferred anyways

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Old 08-21-2014, 02:18 PM   #284
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Your literally arguing just to argue, trying to take a scientific approach to everything. When in real life doesn't matter, if the car runs and drives and as long as it's not super lean it would be good enough to drive it to a tuner. Your making a big deal out of something that doesn't matter and things we have PERSONALLY done work just fine just like you

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Old 08-21-2014, 02:18 PM   #285
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I'm with you on this one. And that whine!!!! Sounds so sick. I could install myself, get it tuned, done. Looking like a much easier option. And that has enough power for me driving around on a DD.
The procharger doesn't whine at all, even with the non helical gears. I've ridden in one.

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Old 08-21-2014, 02:23 PM   #286
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If you have a performance car on the tune it will work which 95% of people have. It's the same size pipe as most cold air intakes. My car ran a little bit rich which I preferred anyways

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Your literally arguing just to argue, trying to take a scientific approach to everything. When in real life doesn't matter, if the car runs and drives and as long as it's not super lean it would be good enough to drive it to a tuner. Your making a big deal out of something that doesn't matter and things we have PERSONALLY done work just fine just like you

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All you needed to say was that your kit includes the same MAF size as stock, because is that not what i said in my original post?

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If the MAF housing was the same size as stock. Otherwise no you couldnt have, injectors or not.

Thats not a knock against this turbo kit, thats just basic tuning.

You, are the one arguing just to argue Connor. My point was you cannot drive (or excuse me, should not) a car if the MAF has been changed and not tuned for. I was then told several times i was wrong, and proved why i was not. The only reason a car will run super lean, with no changes to the tune, is if the MAF size is wrong. And tuning IS a scientific approach, putting **** on and hoping for the best to just limp it to the tuner, is not.
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Old 08-21-2014, 02:25 PM   #287
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I'm not arguing I was just stating a fact that my car ran perfectly fine and that popeyes car ran fine with a big change too. I'm not arguing that's facts

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Old 08-21-2014, 02:39 PM   #288
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I give up connor, obviously with the OEM MAF housing your car ran fine. With no datalogging however, you just think popeye's car was running fine, and i can promise you it was not. Look at the MAF tables i posted, THOSE are facts. His car was running lean, i dont care what you or anyone else says. But enough derailing. Lets see how this dyno comes out tomorrow.
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Old 08-21-2014, 03:01 PM   #289
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We started the car and revved to 1400 with my 93r tune with no problem.
There wasn't even a check engine light
That's the first start vid I have on youtube

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Old 08-21-2014, 03:06 PM   #290
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And the cars have factory wide bands so we can look at them. It's not like I'm just saying stuff to say it. Idles almost perfect to

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Old 08-21-2014, 04:08 PM   #291
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It sounds.... Interesting


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Old 08-21-2014, 04:36 PM   #292
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It sounds.... Interesting


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I'll go ahead and tell you the video doesn't do justice, it's so loud that it didn't pick it up.
I had to yell at coty who was 4 ft away for him to hear me.
It's loud, and deep, infact, 3 or 4x louder than my other setup

It shook the ground. it was so beautiful :')


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Old 08-21-2014, 04:50 PM   #293
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Is it connected to any resonators or mufflers?
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Old 08-21-2014, 05:21 PM   #294
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I've tried to explain it to them and they don't understand lol

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Old 08-21-2014, 05:48 PM   #295
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I've tried to explain it to them and they don't understand lol

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I veugly remember something being said. It's something along the lines of custom mid pipe and the turbos exhaust side just leads to a down pipe. But there are 30 pages on this thread and I don't want to read through it all again to find it.
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Old 08-21-2014, 05:55 PM   #296
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Turbo spool and waste gate blow off are pretty satisfying as well though. Although I still will have a Terminator at some point as a project car. Just love em.

The which is better argument going on now is a moot point. Install what YOU want. Personally, I think the procharger is good for people who want easy, quick power and don't plan on anything crazy. Whereas the turbo setup offers a lot more potential for people who want to get a little nutty.

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Just for my clarification and understanding, are you saying that the pro charger supercharger for the 3.7 one cannot get nutty power from? Can one not obtain 600 rwhp with the pro charger system as one can with the turbo system?

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Old 08-21-2014, 05:57 PM   #297
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And.... car won't be picked up tomorrow morning...
So don't start asking for numbers, because I have none..
All that's left is transmission tuning.

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Old 08-21-2014, 06:07 PM   #298
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Just for my clarification and understanding, are you saying that the pro charger supercharger for the 3.7 one cannot get nutty power from? Can one not obtain 600 rwhp with the pro charger system as one can with the turbo system?

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Correct, the ProCharger is limited. You can do pulley swaps for more boost, but there is a limit to the size of pulley you can use. I think with the nastiest pulley available you wouldn't even be close. If someone can offer results that prove me wrong, feel free.

The turbo has far more potential just by the nature of what it is. Not to mention it offers the capacity to go Twin Turbos in the future. Of course, that's definitely uncharted territory for the 3.7, doesn't mean it isn't viable though.
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Old 08-21-2014, 06:10 PM   #299
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Just for my clarification and understanding, are you saying that the pro charger supercharger for the 3.7 one cannot get nutty power from? Can one not obtain 600 rwhp with the pro charger system as one can with the turbo system?

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You can but at 600 hp you will make about 470 tq and you'll have to be on like 20ish pounds of boost on a p1 or you'll have to get a d1 which is another 1200 or you ship your p1 in and it's 800 bucks. Turbo kit hp/tq usually match with tq a little higher and on lower boost

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Old 08-21-2014, 06:11 PM   #300
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I veugly remember something being said. It's something along the lines of custom mid pipe and the turbos exhaust side just leads to a down pipe. But there are 30 pages on this thread and I don't want to read through it all again to find it.
And I'm saying my exhaust is the same as hassans and yall said it sounded like crap. But when you hear it in person it's awesome driving around; full throttle yes gets pitchy but that's just the wastegates the actual exhaust sounds good!

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Old 08-21-2014, 07:27 PM   #301
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It makes absolutely no sense to me that the car can be properly tuned when the MAF diameter is incorrect. I mean... that's how it calculates how much air is going into the cylinders, it should throw everything off. I'm not trying to argue, I'm just trying to learn how clamphier and popeye think that it can be okay. I understand what Voltwings is saying. I don't understand what the others are saying.


Maybe you guys are saying that it's "good enough"? Good enough to keep low rpms and make it to a tuner to get it properly tuned? Just because a car runs, even if it's seemingly running well, doesn't mean that it's running properly.


Again, not trying to argue, if it's coming off that way. Just trying to learn. What I've read from Voltwings is very convincing, I have not heard a convincing argument from Connor and popeye.
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Old 08-21-2014, 07:39 PM   #302
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I'm not gonna argue anything.
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That manifold and MAF housing started first turn. I ran it around the block on many different occasions long before I got a tune. AND it had the GT throttle body on it. Stock tune. I'm not gonna argue a thing.
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Old 08-21-2014, 07:39 PM   #303
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And I'm saying my exhaust is the same as hassans and yall said it sounded like crap. But when you hear it in person it's awesome driving around; full throttle yes gets pitchy but that's just the wastegates the actual exhaust sounds good!

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Oh i never heard your exhaust. Can I find it on YouTube? I've seen a couple videos with a guy who has a silver Mustang that has a Procharger. Pretty mean sounding and he keeps right at the door handle of a Boss 302 the whole time...
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Old 08-21-2014, 07:58 PM   #304
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I'm not gonna argue anything.
Attachment 164008

That manifold and MAF housing started first turn. I ran it around the block on many different occasions long before I got a tune. AND it had the GT throttle body on it. Stock tune. I'm not gonna argue a thing.


Ummm.... okay I thought I made it clear by explicitly saying that I'm not trying to argue, I'm just trying to learn, but I guess that still wasn't understood. I know you're saying it ran. What I would like to know is WHY and HOW. No one has explained how the tune can compensate for an incorrect MAF diameter. This stuff isn't magic, there's something going on in there that is making it happen. I want to know what that is.


All I'm doing is asking a question. If you don't know the answer, say you don't know, don't just blow it off by saying "I'm not going to argue." Especially when I said that I'm not trying to argue.
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Old 08-21-2014, 08:35 PM   #305
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Stock widebands = self tuning (to a degree) so MAF Housing size is not as critical as with previous narrow band cars.
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Old 08-21-2014, 08:39 PM   #306
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Oh i never heard your exhaust. Can I find it on YouTube? I've seen a couple videos with a guy who has a silver Mustang that has a Procharger. Pretty mean sounding and he keeps right at the door handle of a Boss 302 the whole time...
That's my car

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Old 08-21-2014, 08:42 PM   #307
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Ummm.... okay I thought I made it clear by explicitly saying that I'm not trying to argue, I'm just trying to learn, but I guess that still wasn't understood. I know you're saying it ran. What I would like to know is WHY and HOW. No one has explained how the tune can compensate for an incorrect MAF diameter. This stuff isn't magic, there's something going on in there that is making it happen. I want to know what that is.


All I'm doing is asking a question. If you don't know the answer, say you don't know, don't just blow it off by saying "I'm not going to argue." Especially when I said that I'm not trying to argue.
With the new cars the computers will compensate a lot and learn not by any means a stand alone or efi or anything but enough to idle properly and drive around decent. I'm not saying go out and race it but it learns enough to decently drive it and get around

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Old 08-21-2014, 08:42 PM   #308
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That's my car

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Lol seriously?
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Old 08-21-2014, 08:45 PM   #309
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Lol seriously?
That's the one, they ran with the 1320 folks. Title of the video was "WEIRD Sounding V6 Turbo Stang THROWS DOWN". Can't post the link for reasons, but you can check it out.
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Old 08-21-2014, 08:46 PM   #310
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Stock widebands = self tuning (to a degree) so MAF Housing size is not as critical as with previous narrow band cars.
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With the new cars the computers will compensate a lot and learn not by any means a stand alone or efi or anything but enough to idle properly and drive around decent. I'm not saying go out and race it but it learns enough to decently drive it and get around

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Alright, thanks a lot guys. That doesn't completely satisfy how in depth I want to understand this, but what you guys said at least tells me what to look up and research. Very cool - thank you.
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Old 08-21-2014, 08:48 PM   #311
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Well this thread derailed quickly..
Before I release results, I want y'all to understand that the results were on a dynocom not on a dynojet, and that a dynocom will read lower than a dynojet.
How much, I'm not sure?

Maybe instead of measuring dick size, we could discuss the difference between the dynos

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Old 08-21-2014, 08:53 PM   #312
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The reason I'm saying that is because I can already see y'all discussing my dyno numbers and putting em right up to connors

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Old 08-21-2014, 08:56 PM   #313
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Lol seriously?






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Alright, thanks a lot guys. That doesn't completely satisfy how in depth I want to understand this, but what you guys said at least tells me what to look up and research. Very cool - thank you.

Well how in depth do you want to go? The factory cars come with wide bands, they can read the air fuel percentage that is going through. the computer has all kinds of maps and tables that when it sees certain ratios it compensates.

For example if you put a new intake on or first put a new tune it it idles high and like crap then if you let it keep running for a few minutes it will settle down and compensate enough to idle decent and drive. Like I said it won't completely self tune but it adjusts a decent amount and can get you going. The car has maps that it's supposed to stay in and the computer tries to make it as close to that as it can.

Anyways back to the turbo


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Old 08-21-2014, 09:27 PM   #314
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More interested in the graph rather than peak numbers. Way more information there and just spill the beans. Who cares what it peaked at.

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Old 08-21-2014, 09:28 PM   #315
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More interested in the graph rather than peak numbers. Way more information there and just spill the beans. Who cares what it peaked at.

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I don't have the graph yet, should get it tomorrow morning

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