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Old 12-25-2015, 01:30 AM   #71
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As stated above. Also, many states don't do smog testing. And there is no way of getting close to the power gains legally for the same cost as a careless X or h pipe. The stock cats do not flow well, otherwise it wouldn't be nearly a 15HP gain for removing them.

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Old 12-25-2015, 01:32 AM   #72
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*catless

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Old 12-25-2015, 01:34 AM   #73
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Oh and if you were to get pulled over without cats, you don't have to show them your exhaust. It must be court ordered which allows plenty of time to out the stock X pipe with cats back on the car.

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Old 12-26-2015, 06:10 PM   #74
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Just a note on installation. That bolt on the right rear over the starter that is such a pain. Go to your local hardware store and get you a 8mm x 1 inch bolt with a lock washer and put it in that spot, so much easier than trying to work with the stock bolt .


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Old 04-07-2016, 12:33 PM   #75
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Well installed my BBK ceramic shorties last weekend by myself. It took me abt 5 hours only because 1 manifold bolt to the down pipe on each side decided to unscrew instead of the nut coming off so it was dangling in the flange. I had to use a die grinder to cut the stud in two which was no big deal since they aren't used anyway.

For those like myself who has been hesitating on doing it don't worry it's not bad at all. I didn't have to remove the starter and I used the factory studs & nuts. A 13mm ratchet box wrench is the best tool for the job. The best way I found on the right side is to start the top nuts first. I used one of those telescoping magnets to position the nuts over the stud shoulder and it's all good from there. Since factory exhaust studs & nuts are designed as a tight fit there is very little chance of them ever coming loose and unscrewing on their own. I used a torque wrench on the nuts I could reach then checked the resistance with the box wrench and used it as a guide on tightening the rest.

My Stang is a DD that I put 70+ miles on it every day. I check them today and after several hundred miles no change in the torque.

I run AB Borla tour and the shorties do make it a little quieter at idle and on the highway I can talk on the phone a listen to music now without fighting the reverb. But any acceleration it lets you and anyone around know there's something going on. It is a deeper tone, the bottom end is obviously improved. On hills the cruse needed to down shift to climb it doesn't now. My highway commute I average 80-90 mph and in 2 weeks it shows .3 mpg improvement. I know it's not mush so far but I really wasn't expecting any increase.

I have a SCT X4 sitting on the shelf. Kinda like the headers I need to quit jacking around and just do it...
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Old 04-07-2016, 12:48 PM   #76
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Just a note on installation. That bolt on the right rear over the starter that is such a pain. Go to your local hardware store and get you a 8mm x 1 inch bolt with a lock washer and put it in that spot, so much easier than trying to work with the stock bolt .

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That's a great idea. Too bad I didn't think of that almost 2 years ago when I put mine on.
Due to the end of the stud not leaving enough room to get a box end wrench in there and the fact that, in my case, I couldn't get an open ended wrench to work for me, I ended up grinding down a box end wrench to make it thin enough to get over that stud.
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Old 04-07-2016, 02:36 PM   #77
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Oh and if you were to get pulled over without cats, you don't have to show them your exhaust. It must be court ordered which allows plenty of time to out the stock X pipe with cats back on the car.
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They don't need a court order to look at your exhaust. All they need is a small mirror attached to a stick and one small flashlight. Shine the light on a portion of the mirror and they can look under your car and see your exhaust system. No, it isn't a violation of your 4th amendment rights as they are in plain sight.
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Old 04-07-2016, 02:42 PM   #78
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They don't need a court order to look at your exhaust. All they need is a small mirror attached to a stick and one small flashlight. Shine the light on a portion of the mirror and they can look under your car and see your exhaust system. No, it isn't a violation of your 4th amendment rights as they are in plain sight.

Having to use a Mirror or other device to look at something Is Not Then In Plain Sight!... Plain Sight means something that is Clearly Visible from your view point using Nothing More than Your Eyes!..


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Old 04-07-2016, 05:33 PM   #79
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Having to use a Mirror or other device to look at something Is Not Then In Plain Sight!... Plain Sight means something that is Clearly Visible from your view point using Nothing More than Your Eyes!..


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As I was told by my Neighbor's son in law who is a State Trooper, if the exhaust is louder than stock they have probable cause to look at it. If by chance you do not want him to look at it and the exhaust is louder than stock he can and will get a warrant. If he finds anything other than OEM Cats or feels that the emission control devises have been altered on it wave bye bye to it, it will be impounded until the judge releases it. So to all with long tubes even with a Catted X or H it is still illegal. BTW we do not have emissions testing here, but you can still loose your car at any given time
To all that know better than anyone else and as I have said before my friend was written for other than OEM cats, this was after it passed smog twice and the initial fine was $15,000 that was lowered to $1500 after the truck was returned to stock
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Old 04-07-2016, 06:36 PM   #80
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As I was told by my Neighbor's son in law who is a State Trooper, if the exhaust is louder than stock they have probable cause to look at it. If by chance you do not want him to look at it and the exhaust is louder than stock he can and will get a warrant. If he finds anything other than OEM Cats or feels that the emission control devises have been altered on it wave bye bye to it, it will be impounded until the judge releases it. So to all with long tubes even with a Catted X or H it is still illegal. BTW we do not have emissions testing here, but you can still loose your car at any given time

To all that know better than anyone else and as I have said before my friend was written for other than OEM cats, this was after it passed smog twice and the initial fine was $15,000 that was lowered to $1500 after the truck was returned to stock

Lol. Thanks for helping to prove your original statement was incorrect!.. A Warrant IS a Court Order by the way!.. Also Louder Than Stock?.. Well they have to have a way to prove that!.. Officer simply cannot just say, "well it's louder than stock!.." That means they would have to know how loud it was when it was stock, that's If it was even modded!.. Lol. This is a Very Slippery Slope for Officers, seeing as they are not Trained to be Mechanics!.. And if you wanted to fight it in court it is a simple win!..

By the way, I do have a Back Ground in Law Enforcement!.. 😎


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Old 04-07-2016, 06:47 PM   #81
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Old 04-07-2016, 06:50 PM   #82
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Old 04-07-2016, 08:21 PM   #83
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Lol. Thanks for helping to prove your original statement was incorrect!.. A Warrant IS a Court Order by the way!.. Also Louder Than Stock?.. Well they have to have a way to prove that!.. Officer simply cannot just say, "well it's louder than stock!.." That means they would have to know how loud it was when it was stock, that's If it was even modded!.. Lol. This is a Very Slippery Slope for Officers, seeing as they are not Trained to be Mechanics!.. And if you wanted to fight it in court it is a simple win!..

By the way, I do have a Back Ground in Law Enforcement!.. 😎


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You make it seem that there is no way to get the said search warrant.
Seems they don't have any problem around here with the exhaust. If it is loud enough to hurt your ears it probably is not stock. As I was told if you can hear it 2 or 3 blocks away it is more than likely modified also. You can also go to some towns around here that there are DB meters in some of the cars (they will get you on your Stereo also).
You might have a law enforcement background, and yet you have never sat on the side of the road waiting to get a search warrant, or waiting for the search warrant to arrive so you can be searched (I had to have paper work to break a seal on my trailer).
So far I have done nothing but prove myself correct. I might not have Law Enforcement in my background but I do see enough around here that at least here the Police are not neutered.
I am guessing reading the Mods done to someones car in their signature is hearsay and can't be used also, Oh wait, I have seen that on another site
The Fact is every time someone brings up anything but long tubes and an off road pipe for their cars they get you need long tubes and an off road pipe even though they are illegal in all 50 states because of federal law and no one ever says a thing about what can happen. That includes loosing your car and forget ever trying to sell it with that stuff on it.
BTW I have been refused registration, had cars impounded and more than one exhaust ticket in my 38 years of driving and modifying cars, never had to worry about them being wrong it always had to do more with me being able to prove I was right.
Slippery slope my butt
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Old 04-07-2016, 09:00 PM   #84
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You make it seem that there is no way to get the said search warrant.

Seems they don't have any problem around here with the exhaust. If it is loud enough to hurt your ears it probably is not stock. As I was told if you can hear it 2 or 3 blocks away it is more than likely modified also. You can also go to some towns around here that there are DB meters in some of the cars (they will get you on your Stereo also).

You might have a law enforcement background, and yet you have never sat on the side of the road waiting to get a search warrant, or waiting for the search warrant to arrive so you can be searched (I had to have paper work to break a seal on my trailer).

So far I have done nothing but prove myself correct. I might not have Law Enforcement in my background but I do see enough around here that at least here the Police are not neutered.

I am guessing reading the Mods done to someones car in their signature is hearsay and can't be used also, Oh wait, I have seen that on another site

The Fact is every time someone brings up anything but long tubes and an off road pipe for their cars they get you need long tubes and an off road pipe even though they are illegal in all 50 states because of federal law and no one ever says a thing about what can happen. That includes loosing your car and forget ever trying to sell it with that stuff on it.

BTW I have been refused registration, had cars impounded and more than one exhaust ticket in my 38 years of driving and modifying cars, never had to worry about them being wrong it always had to do more with me being able to prove I was right.

Slippery slope my butt

Lol. You first said to someone that they didn't need a Court Order to see if their exhaust is modded!.. Simply because it's in "plain sight", and all the officer needed was a mirror and so on....

I corrected you on said "plain sight" issue!.. Lol

Then you stated the officer can get a warrant and so on... True!.. BUT!... Most will Not waist their time, or a Judges Time to get a Warrant just for an individual's Exhaust!..

Just let go dude!.. Your trying to hard!.. 😎


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Old 04-07-2016, 09:21 PM   #85
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Lol. You first said to someone that they didn't need a Court Order to see if their exhaust is modded!.. Simply because it's in "plain sight", and all the officer needed was a mirror and so on....

I corrected you on said "plain sight" issue!.. Lol

Then you stated the officer can get a warrant and so on... True!.. BUT!... Most will Not waist their time, or a Judges Time to get a Warrant just for an individual's Exhaust!..

Just let go dude!.. Your trying to hard!.. 😎


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Actually I said the loud exhaust gave them probable cause, I didn't say anything about in plain site.
Although out side of the car is considered open game. I have also seen a lift brought out to a rest area to do vehicle safety checks, trucks get it all the time.
I am not the one that said they couldn't, that was you and I have seen them do just what I said, and more than once.
BTW, I have not tried yet
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Old 04-07-2016, 09:40 PM   #86
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Actually I said the loud exhaust gave them probable cause, I didn't say anything about in plain site.

Although out side of the car is considered open game. I have also seen a lift brought out to a rest area to do vehicle safety checks, trucks get it all the time.

I am not the one that said they couldn't, that was you and I have seen them do just what I said, and more than once.

BTW, I have not tried yet

Lol. Sorry my bad!.. Mistook you for another!..


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Old 04-08-2016, 06:55 PM   #87
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HEY! Look what i found right at the top of the Forum page-
A beginner's guide to modifying your V6
and inside


"3. Headers.
The general consensus here (as well as in the 5.0 forums, where i spend most of my time) is that Long tubes will net you higher peak gains, and shorties will give more low end and mid range grunt.

Longtubes: Long tubes will require a tune. One, because you are deleting the cats, but two, because of the way headers flow. The technology in these Ti-vct motors is incredible, and they basically allow you to tune the car to optimize virtually any set up at any rpm. Here is an article on understanding tuned length headers, and how the Ti-vct system allows us to maximize these gas pulses, but also why the tune is incredibly important to making power.
Let's get technical. The biggest controversy in header design is the "equal length" versus "shorty" styles - which is best?

As far as the rest of your exhaust, you will need a mid pipe that is designed especially for long tubes. This is very important when planning your exhaust mods, a mid pipe that works with stock headers WILL NOT work with long tubes.

Shorties: Whether a tune is "needed" with shorties or not is another highly debated topic. Seeing as how the runners lengths are still "tuned," i believe the cam timing can be optimized to match, therefore i would suggest a tune. However, the changes are a little less drastic than longtubes, so you likely can get by without a tune for some time."
-Voltwings
My God, that thread covers nearly every topic we talk about on here. If we are forced to read that for every time we talk about something on here, they might as well call this the Voltwingsevolution forum. lol

There are many different opinions on this site and many (including myself) value them as much or more. I don't have the time or patience to read through that thread, but I did read this one and got some very good intel on a product that is on my short list for mods.

So thanks OP and the kind people that replied!!
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