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Old 10-01-2012, 07:29 AM   #1
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2nd gear 4,000 RPM (weird sound)

Recently I've noticed a small vibration/rattle coming from the engine [2012 5.0]. Under hard acceleration around 4000 RPM. I've looked up videos of pinging and it sounds kinda similar.. Not as drastic though. Car is completely stock and i run on 87octane. Has 25,000 miles on it. Could it in fact be engine pinging? Or something else?
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Old 10-01-2012, 07:46 AM   #2
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Cheap gas sir. 91 or higher
IMO
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Old 10-01-2012, 08:13 AM   #3
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Yeah, I wouldn't put anything less than 91 octane in your tank.
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Old 10-01-2012, 08:59 AM   #4
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I would try better gas first, I only buy shell premium and don't have any issues with it.

You bought a nice car so treat her well and spend the extra .25 per gallon, I mean it's about $3.50 per tank
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Old 10-01-2012, 09:40 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by GrabberBlue5.0
I would try better gas first, I only buy shell premium and don't have any issues with it.

You bought a nice car so treat her well and spend the extra .25 per gallon, I mean it's about $3.50 per tank
Yep, well worth the investment in your engine.
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:30 AM   #6
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All fuel comes from pretty much the same place, its the additives and maintenance of the fuel and fuel pumps that is gonna help you out. I had been filling up with 91 from Quick trip (shell). For three tanks i had switched to 87 at the corner gas station (valero) under spirited driving or maintaining higher than normal rpms my 5.0 would on occasion develop a misfire in cylinder six, back off and drive normal it would go away. switched back to QT (shell) staying at 87 it never had a misfire again, its not necessarily the octane in every case. The additives and maintenance of pumps is worth the slightly higher prices. I have pulled in to QT and they have all the pumps shut down for maintenance/filter changes and to re-certify there pumps.
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:51 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by GrabberBlue5.0
I would try better gas first, I only buy shell premium and don't have any issues with it.

You bought a nice car so treat her well and spend the extra .25 per gallon, I mean it's about $3.50 per tank
+10
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Old 10-01-2012, 10:52 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by 2012Vader5.0
All fuel comes from pretty much the same place, its the additives and maintenance of the fuel and fuel pumps that is gonna help you out. I had been filling up with 91 from Quick trip (shell). For three tanks i had switched to 87 at the corner gas station (valero) under spirited driving or maintaining higher than normal rpms my 5.0 would on occasion develop a misfire in cylinder six, back off and drive normal it would go away. switched back to QT (shell) staying at 87 it never had a misfire again, its not necessarily the octane in every case. The additives and maintenance of pumps is worth the slightly higher prices. I have pulled in to QT and they have all the pumps shut down for maintenance/filter changes and to re-certify there pumps.
Exactly! Petroleum is petroleum is petroleum. The additives and distribution chain have a lot of effect as you said. Where do you think the cheapo stations save their money? It's not because the fuel is cheaper...

I used to run a mix of BP, Speedway and Shell and had constant issues in many cars by many manufacturers. I tried running only shell, only BP, and only speedway for a month each, and Shell was the only one that consistently had good fuel. Ford motors in particular seem to be picky about fuel though.
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Old 10-01-2012, 12:14 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by 2012Vader5.0
All fuel comes from pretty much the same place, its the additives and maintenance of the fuel and fuel pumps that is gonna help you out. I had been filling up with 91 from Quick trip (shell). For three tanks i had switched to 87 at the corner gas station (valero) under spirited driving or maintaining higher than normal rpms my 5.0 would on occasion develop a misfire in cylinder six, back off and drive normal it would go away. switched back to QT (shell) staying at 87 it never had a misfire again, its not necessarily the octane in every case. The additives and maintenance of pumps is worth the slightly higher prices. I have pulled in to QT and they have all the pumps shut down for maintenance/filter changes and to re-certify there pumps.
Qt gas is bullcrap I fill up on qt and go.back and forth to work and I need gas by Thursday..shell. chevron sat .its unreal
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Old 10-01-2012, 12:23 PM   #10
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Qt gas is bullcrap I fill up on qt and go.back and forth to work and I need gas by Thursday..shell. chevron sat .its unreal
How many miles are you seeing out of a tank?

*edit: depending on driving habits i see about 250 310
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Old 10-01-2012, 01:10 PM   #11
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Thanks ppl, I'm just going to go fill up with 93 octane. Hopefully it'll run smoother.
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Old 10-01-2012, 01:11 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2012Vader5.0

How many miles are you seeing out of a tank?

*edit: depending on driving habits i see about 250 310
I usually get about 250, never came close to 310...
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Old 10-01-2012, 01:45 PM   #13
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I will say that my fuel economy has gone up with shell fuel, I've been runnin it since I got my roush mufflers installed, I have been harder on the throttle and average better mpgs. I do not go by the car, I do all the math and tracking through and app in which I input all info myself, and this has been a long term test, I've been running nothing but shell for almost 2 months now

---------- Post added at 02:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:44 PM ----------

Before I was averaging 270 per tank and now it's ~315
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Old 10-01-2012, 01:48 PM   #14
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Hmm I only average 180-200 on a tank using BP 93 and its usually under "spirited" driving habits... Does it sound normal?
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Old 10-01-2012, 01:53 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch
Cheap gas sir. 91 or higher
IMO
If it wasn't igniting why would higher octane change anything?

---------- Post added at 11:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:51 AM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure
Yeah, I wouldn't put anything less than 91 octane in your tank.
I don't understand why people think that higher octane means better gas. It technically means worse gas in terms of not people able to combust as easily.
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Old 10-01-2012, 02:07 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Mustangs View Post

If it wasn't igniting why would higher octane change anything?

---------- Post added at 11:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:51 AM ----------



I don't understand why people think that higher octane means better gas. It technically means worse gas in terms of not people able to combust as easily.
It doesn't mean better gas. It means it burns at a higher temp. So, in OP's case, hopefully it will stop pre-ignition that might be happening.

The additives in the gas make it better gas.
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Old 10-01-2012, 02:51 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustangs

If it wasn't igniting why would higher octane change anything?

---------- Post added at 11:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:51 AM ----------



I don't understand why people think that higher octane means better gas. It technically means worse gas in terms of not people able to combust as easily.
What?!?!? For your first half, the proper term is detonating, this vehicle was made to use 91 or higher, while it can use 87 it is far less than ideal, engine will pull timing WHEN knock is detected, not if it is detected. So again not ideal.

Higher octane is FAR from meaning worse gas. Higher octane means higher energy. Yes it requires more heat/pressure, but it also yields more energy output.

Sure you can eat sugar but your body will burn it up quickly, but eating starches and grains (complex carbohydrates) will give you better longer lasting energy. It burns slowly but also gives your body exponentially more energy and is far better for you
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Old 10-01-2012, 02:55 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mustangs

If it wasn't igniting why would higher octane change anything?

---------- Post added at 11:53 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:51 AM ----------



I don't understand why people think that higher octane means better gas. It technically means worse gas in terms of not people able to combust as easily.
Im not sure on the 5.0's but on my Cobra she requires premium. Just figuring more octane smoother burn. No gas expert here just my $1.27.
Plus for performance made engines you'd figure higher octane, look at race cars and jets( I know its a hella difference from them to us) higher octane for a reason. If not then just put 87 in those suckers
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Old 10-01-2012, 02:56 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch

Im not sure on the 5.0's but on my Cobra she requires premium. Just figuring more octane smoother burn. No gas expert here just my $1.27.
Plus for performance made engines you'd figure higher octane, look at race cars and jets( I know its a hella difference from them to us) higher octane for a reason. If not then just put 87 in those suckers
It's due mostly to compression and timing advance... But yeah, you're on the right track for sure butch
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:01 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure

It doesn't mean better gas. It means it burns at a higher temp. So, in OP's case, hopefully it will stop pre-ignition that might be happening.

The additives in the gas make it better gas.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrabberBlue5.0

What?!?!? For your first half, the proper term is detonating, this vehicle was made to use 91 or higher, while it can use 87 it is far less than ideal, engine will pull timing WHEN knock is detected, not if it is detected. So again not ideal.

Higher octane is FAR from meaning worse gas. Higher octane means higher energy. Yes it requires more heat/pressure, but it also yields more energy output.

Sure you can eat sugar but your body will burn it up quickly, but eating starches and grains (complex carbohydrates) will give you better longer lasting energy. It burns slowly but also gives your body exponentially more energy and is far better for you
Quote:
Originally Posted by GrabberBlue5.0

It's due mostly to compression and timing advance... But yeah, you're
on the right track for sure butch
So glad I didnt end up alone on this one, a subject im not to great at + alone would of had to jump off a bridge or something.

So compression and timing, higher octane better compression smoother timing? (I dont even know how to ask about this but hope it makes sense)
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:19 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch

So glad I didnt end up alone on this one, a subject im not to great at + alone would of had to jump off a bridge or something.

So compression and timing, higher octane better compression smoother timing? (I dont even know how to ask about this but hope it makes sense)
You could give a 16 week college class on this subject but I'll try to sum it up quickly

Combustion relies on a combination of pressure and heat, the higher the heat, the less pressure that is needed and the higher the pressure the less heat is required. A compression ratio is basically a ratio of how much the air/fuel mixture is compressed. 11.5:1 (the coyote) means that the piston compresses the air/fuel in the cylinder to 11.5 times smaller at TDC than it is at BDC, also meaning the air/fuel mixture is now 11.5 times more dense. A lower octane fuel will burn at lower temp/pressure than a higher octane fuel. Therefore it's required to use fuel with a higher combustion temp/pressure with higher compression.

Timing has to do with when the spark comes from the spark plug and is a whole different conversation lol
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:45 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by GrabberBlue5.0

You could give a 16 week college class on this subject but I'll try to sum it up quickly

Combustion relies on a combination of pressure and heat, the higher the heat, the less pressure that is needed and the higher the pressure the less heat is required. A compression ratio is basically a ratio of how much the air/fuel mixture is compressed. 11.5:1 (the coyote) means that the piston compresses the air/fuel in the cylinder to 11.5 times smaller at TDC than it is at BDC, also meaning the air/fuel mixture is now 11.5 times more dense. A lower octane fuel will burn at lower temp/pressure than a higher octane fuel. Therefore it's required to use fuel with a higher combustion temp/pressure with higher compression.

Timing has to do with when the spark comes from the spark plug and is a whole different conversation lol
Jaja.
Ok first things first TDC and BDC stand for?
Next,
does the pressure it takes for combustion come from the injectors or does it come from the fuel? Like this octanes pressure needs to be a 7(91) and this octanes pressure need to be at a 4(87), just as a reference outta 10. These numbers mean nothing just an example.
And the temp it needs for combustion where does that come from?
Higher compression the lower the number? (Like 11.5:1 is lower than 10:1)
Is there a way that there would be higher heat/pressure than pressure/heat?
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:48 PM   #23
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TDC = Top Dead Center

BDC = Bottom Dead Center

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Old 10-01-2012, 03:50 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure
TDC = Top Dead Center

BDC = Bottom Dead Center

Gracias.
Now what does that mean jaja, is it wide open to idle?
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:50 PM   #25
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The higher the number, the higher the compression.
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:51 PM   #26
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IMA hafta go over it after work so I don't get in trouble.
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:53 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Butch

Gracias.
Now what does that mean jaja, is it wide open to idle?
Or or or is it the position of the piston, top an bottom?

---------- Post added at 02:53 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:52 PM ----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Azure
The higher the number, the higher the compression.
I thought it was backwards. Lower # higher compression hmm
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:53 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch

Jaja.
Ok first things first TDC and BDC stand for?
Next,
does the pressure it takes for combustion come from the injectors or does it come from the fuel? Like this octanes pressure needs to be a 7(91) and this octanes pressure need to be at a 4(87), just as a reference outta 10. These numbers mean nothing just an example.
And the temp it needs for combustion where does that come from?
Higher compression the lower the number? (Like 11.5:1 is lower than 10:1)
Is there a way that there would be higher heat/pressure than pressure/heat?
The pressure comes from the piston moving upwards toward the heads in the cylinder, higher compression means there is more pressure in the cylinder. Temp necessary for combustion is determined by the octane rating of the fuel, the higher the octane the higher the temp needed.

Top dead center is when the piston as as high as is will go in the cylinder and BDC is the opposite
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Old 10-01-2012, 03:53 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Azure
IMA hafta go over it after work so I don't get in trouble.
Jaja, work on sir
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Old 10-01-2012, 04:10 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by GrabberBlue5.0

The pressure comes from the piston moving upwards toward the heads in the cylinder, higher compression means there is more pressure in the cylinder. Temp necessary for combustion is determined by the octane rating of the fuel, the higher the octane the higher the temp needed.

Top dead center is when the piston as as high as is will go in the cylinder and BDC is the opposite
Ah gotcha.
You can get the piston closer to the head correct? Meaning higher compression?
Now where does the temp come from?
(You've been sucked into the noob tank, apologies sir)
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Old 10-01-2012, 04:27 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch

Ah gotcha.
You can get the piston closer to the head correct? Meaning higher compression?
Now where does the temp come from?
(You've been sucked into the noob tank, apologies sir)
Geez what a noob haha

In your motor the pistons move up and down in the cylinder, as the piston moves upward it compresses the air/fuel mixture, the spark ignites the fuel and the rapid expansion of the mixture pushes the piston back downward, this motion is what turns your crankshaft and drives the motor.

It's actually not noob stuff lol, well maybe your questions are a little but this is still very complicated stuff overall.

This has by no means been perfected and no one truly understands every bit of the mechanics and physics of it, that's why there are still advancements in combustion engines.

And hey, at least you didn't ask me which CAI/tune/mufflers are best hahaha
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Old 10-01-2012, 05:24 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by GrabberBlue5.0

Geez what a noob haha

In your motor the pistons move up and down in the cylinder, as the piston moves upward it compresses the air/fuel mixture, the spark ignites the fuel and the rapid expansion of the mixture pushes the piston back downward, this motion is what turns your crankshaft and drives the motor.

It's actually not noob stuff lol, well maybe your questions are a little but this is still very complicated stuff overall.

This has by no means been perfected and no one truly understands every bit of the mechanics and physics of it, that's why there are still advancements in combustion engines.

And hey, at least you didn't ask me which CAI/tune/mufflers are best hahaha
Ah I see. So for all this to begin that's were the fly wheel and starter come in? The starter turning the fly wheel initiates the first air/fuel suck then it detonates causing the piston to push on the rod to push on the crank, which then turns and pushes the other rods to pistons and so on and so forth?
Well hmm not so noob brain jaja.
I bet technology has a lot to do with the advancements, ,
Oh and well I was gonna ask but never mind I guess jaja jk. No such thing as best (IMO) only personal preferences ..
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Old 10-01-2012, 05:44 PM   #33
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How much compresion does the new 5.0 have?
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Old 10-01-2012, 05:54 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Butch

Ah I see. So for all this to begin that's were the fly wheel and starter come in? The starter turning the fly wheel initiates the first air/fuel suck then it detonates causing the piston to push on the rod to push on the crank, which then turns and pushes the other rods to pistons and so on and so forth?
Well hmm not so noob brain jaja.
I bet technology has a lot to do with the advancements, ,
Oh and well I was gonna ask but never mind I guess jaja jk. No such thing as best (IMO) only personal preferences ..
Yea, it all actually very very complex, seriously. That's the beginning, the way I see it, I'm just a noob too haha

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Quote:
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How much compresion does the new 5.0 have?
It has an 11.0:1 cr (compression ratio) earlier I said 11.5:1 which is incorrect sorry
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Old 10-01-2012, 05:58 PM   #35
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Even with a aluminum head. U cant pull off 11.0.1 on 87.
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