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Old 04-13-2014, 01:49 PM   #1
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BAMA tune issues...again

Well I have tunes for life from BAMA and have had 3/4 tunes go bad, maybe 4, but I never ran the street tune.

First tune I noticed, the BAMA cam 91R tune. It didn't lope, just gave me horrible mpg. I sent out for a revised tune.

Second tune, the 91 Performance. I ran this at the strip, because at the time I only had the race tune with the ghost cam and didn't want to run that. My two fastest runs were 13.6 at 108.

This was when I switched to VMP. I now get better response and gas mileage, but haven't had a chance to get it to the track.

Third tune, the revised ghost cam. It ran awesome for a whole afternoon. Then it threw the P219A code for "engine bank 1 lean". I immediately shut it off and swapped back to my VMP tune and the code hasn't reappeared since.

I called BAMA about this. The rep seemed a bit rude and told me it was a bad O2 sensor. I told him about the code going away after swapping tunes and he said he had no idea then, and I should do a data log. If the tune leans out one or both side(s) of the engine, the LAST thing I want to do is some WOT pulls. Anyone have a similar experience? I'm tempted to wipe all of the tunes off of my SC3 and just run the VMP.
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Old 04-13-2014, 03:53 PM   #2
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The moral of the story is simple. VMP tunes good, Bama not tunes highly questionable. Seems like a no brainer to me.
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Old 04-13-2014, 05:16 PM   #3
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Customer service less than great. Tunes worse than their service. That's why I run my VMP now. When I get more mods, I'll swap to AED probably.

I just couldn't believe they suggested I do WOT pulls when the engine is running lean, rather than offering another revised tune.

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Old 04-13-2014, 05:57 PM   #4
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I don't see why people continue to go with Bama when they are clearly not good tuners. Sure there are some that like there tunes but when you have so many dissatisfied customers it speaks volumes to the tuners and there knowledge of these cars. You don't see people constantly complaining about or having problems with AED, Lund or JPC to name a few.
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Old 04-13-2014, 06:15 PM   #5
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Welcome to the club man. I dropped them and went to Lund. They are great!

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Old 04-14-2014, 08:29 AM   #6
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First, stay away from Ghost tunes. The negatives outweigh the pointless cool sound.
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Old 04-14-2014, 08:49 AM   #7
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I wish any of their other tunes were worth a damn, since I have tunes for life from them. I regret buying out of convenience rather than quality.
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Old 04-14-2014, 09:45 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KSconvert View Post
Well I have tunes for life from BAMA and have had 3/4 tunes go bad, maybe 4, but I never ran the street tune.

First tune I noticed, the BAMA cam 91R tune. It didn't lope, just gave me horrible mpg. I sent out for a revised tune.

Second tune, the 91 Performance. I ran this at the strip, because at the time I only had the race tune with the ghost cam and didn't want to run that. My two fastest runs were 13.6 at 108.

This was when I switched to VMP. I now get better response and gas mileage, but haven't had a chance to get it to the track.

Third tune, the revised ghost cam. It ran awesome for a whole afternoon. Then it threw the P219A code for "engine bank 1 lean". I immediately shut it off and swapped back to my VMP tune and the code hasn't reappeared since.

I called BAMA about this. The rep seemed a bit rude and told me it was a bad O2 sensor. I told him about the code going away after swapping tunes and he said he had no idea then, and I should do a data log. If the tune leans out one or both side(s) of the engine, the LAST thing I want to do is some WOT pulls. Anyone have a similar experience? I'm tempted to wipe all of the tunes off of my SC3 and just run the VMP.
I'm sorry to hear about the issues you're experiencing with your Tunes. It's pretty clear that something is right here. We tune more Mustangs than anyone else in the world so you shouldn't be having an issue with (1) Tune, though along (4). This is a red flag for me to step in for sure. I would have stepped in after the first revision, had I known about it!

That being said, can you please shoot me a PM with your order number included and I'll make sure you're taken care of. I'll get you in direct contact with our head tuning specialist. We should have your tune ironed out in no time. If not, I'll credit you back the cost of the free tunes for life as it's clear you've had no luck with us as of late.

Hope this helps!

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Old 04-14-2014, 09:54 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AMDanBailer View Post
I'm sorry to hear about the issues you're experiencing with your Tunes. It's pretty clear that something is right here. We tune more Mustangs than anyone else in the world so you shouldn't be having an issue with (1) Tune, though along (4). This is a red flag for me to step in for sure. I would have stepped in after the first revision, had I known about it!

That being said, can you please shoot me a PM with your order number included and I'll make sure you're taken care of. I'll get you in direct contact with our head tuning specialist. We should have your tune ironed out in no time. If not, I'll credit you back the cost of the free tunes for life as it's clear you've had no luck with us as of late.

Hope this helps!

-Dan
haha.. I just sent him a PM telling him to contact you. You know i HATE Bama, but you guys at AM are great.
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Old 04-14-2014, 12:22 PM   #10
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I don't see why people continue to go with Bama when they are clearly not good tuners. Sure there are some that like there tunes but when you have so many dissatisfied customers it speaks volumes to the tuners and there knowledge of these cars. You don't see people constantly complaining about or having problems with AED, Lund or JPC to name a few.
Bama is slowly getting worse as they have blown up. They have great prices and free shipping and generally are easy to deal with but it seems in the last 2-3 years their ability to diagnose has gone down as they have more asses to answer phones with less experience.

I loved their tunes up until I was cammed. Tune ran great but power left on the table. After cams, a dyno tune is always a better idea.

OP, how long did you drive after the VMP was reloaded? I would think the ECU is reset after each tune possibly clearing the code?

Are you catless?
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Old 04-14-2014, 12:25 PM   #11
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I hope it works out for you. What is a VMP tune? I did a search and didn't find anything. Also, I have felt like the people at Bama come off a little rude whenever I talk to them too....

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Old 04-14-2014, 03:42 PM   #12
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I hope it works out for you. What is a VMP tune? I did a search and didn't find anything.
VMP Tuning - Superchargers, Tuners, Custom Tunes, & Performance Parts
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Old 04-14-2014, 03:43 PM   #13
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I hope it works out for you. What is a VMP tune? I did a search and didn't find anything. Also, I have felt like the people at Bama come off a little rude whenever I talk to them too....

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Google "VMP tuning". Justin is great. They told me 5-10 business days to get my tune (you can pay $50 extra and get it guaranteed in 48 hours or less). I got my tune after 3 days and at 10pm on a Sunday.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Borii View Post
Bama is slowly getting worse as they have blown up. They have great prices and free shipping and generally are easy to deal with but it seems in the last 2-3 years their ability to diagnose has gone down as they have more asses to answer phones with less experience.

I loved their tunes up until I was cammed. Tune ran great but power left on the table. After cams, a dyno tune is always a better idea.

OP, how long did you drive after the VMP was reloaded? I would think the ECU is reset after each tune possibly clearing the code?

Are you catless?
Yes I'm catless, and I switched back to the VMP tune about a week ago. That seems to happen with a lot of companies. The bigger they get, the quicker quality control is unable to keep up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by AMDanBailer View Post
I'm sorry to hear about the issues you're experiencing with your Tunes. It's pretty clear that something is right here. We tune more Mustangs than anyone else in the world so you shouldn't be having an issue with (1) Tune, though along (4). This is a red flag for me to step in for sure. I would have stepped in after the first revision, had I known about it!

That being said, can you please shoot me a PM with your order number included and I'll make sure you're taken care of. I'll get you in direct contact with our head tuning specialist. We should have your tune ironed out in no time. If not, I'll credit you back the cost of the free tunes for life as it's clear you've had no luck with us as of late.

Hope this helps!

-Dan
I love you guys over at AM. I've never had any issues with you guys and your phone/internet reps are awesome. I'll give BAMA another shot but I'm not risking my engine with another ghost cam tune.
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Old 04-14-2014, 08:57 PM   #14
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For my two cents, I love my Steeda tunes. Have worked flawlessly.

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Old 04-14-2014, 10:29 PM   #15
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To think I was actually thinking about getting BAMA tunes... whew. Glad I came across some research first. As far as lean WOT goes. I mean, as long as you aren't boosted in which you'd spike lean, that's a lot of crap going wrong. Other than that I've just seen cats glowing red and starting to melt the inside but you said you were catless? I dunno. Maybe it does more damage than I initially thought on an NA motor.
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Old 04-15-2014, 02:45 AM   #16
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Quick question for the OP...
When u had the bank lean condition, did you have any other indicators of something wrong? Any knocks, pings, or ticks? Or just the light?
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Old 04-15-2014, 06:10 AM   #17
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I can't say for sure. My mind was too busy thinking "oh sht. oh sht. oh sht." to remember to listen for anything. But that means nothing was prominent enough for me to hear it unless I was listening for it, so most likely just the light.

I should also note that tunes 1 and 2 (performance and cam) from BAMA may have disabled some of the dash lights, at least one for sure. When I bought my wheel/tire setup from AM, I opted against the TPMS. But when I originally installed them, I was still running the 89 performance tune and no dash light came on for the sensor error. It wasn't until I got the VMP tune that the light came on. It also came on with the 2nd BAMA cam tune.
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Old 04-15-2014, 08:32 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KSconvert View Post
Google "VMP tuning". Justin is great. They told me 5-10 business days to get my tune (you can pay $50 extra and get it guaranteed in 48 hours or less). I got my tune after 3 days and at 10pm on a Sunday.



Yes I'm catless, and I switched back to the VMP tune about a week ago. That seems to happen with a lot of companies. The bigger they get, the quicker quality control is unable to keep up.



I love you guys over at AM. I've never had any issues with you guys and your phone/internet reps are awesome. I'll give BAMA another shot but I'm not risking my engine with another ghost cam tune.
Catless. That is your code. The tunes just turn off that code for you. You can do it yourself.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:00 AM   #19
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I have been catless since February and this was the first instance that code has come up. I had also been driving around several times that day before the code was thrown.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:08 AM   #20
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I have been catless since February and this was the first instance that code has come up.
Mileage will vary.

Catless will cause a code. This isn't a secret. The tune simply turns off the 02 sensors. You can literally do it yourself.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:08 AM   #21
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Its bama. I will say this again they are canned tunes. They can say they are not all they want. The questions they ask are already options in SCT software. There is a reason they can't tune for a blower/ turbo or e85. They do not know how to tune.

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Old 04-15-2014, 09:11 AM   #22
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Catless. That is your code. The tunes just turn off that code for you. You can do it yourself.
Being catless should throw a Catalyst deficiency code, or a bad rear o2 sensor code. Not a lean condition code.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:18 AM   #23
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Being catless should throw a Catalyst deficiency code, or a bad rear o2 sensor code. Not a lean condition code.
It can do both for various reasons.

Here is a quote from a different thread (Beats typing this all) lol.

This is specifically for his code. You can find several threads with varying codes, including the OP's, when installing and "tuning" o/R X PIPES.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2011GrabberGT
An offroad X is going to completely change the flow rate and speed of the exhaust flow, along with substantially cooling it down in the process. The cats create heat and their slight restriction creates back pressure that will slow down the exhaust flow and further increase EGT.

I believe that code is a result of the PCM's interpretations of the upstream sensors to determine the A/F ratio of each cylinder in each bank. Without having an individual O2 sensor in each bank, that would require it to monitor individual exhaust pulses referenced to cylinder firing, which as you could imagine would require a great deal of PCM, engine, and exhaust system calibration and tuning. It has to be a very dialed in system to properly infer and interpret air fuel ratio changes at that speed/resolution. My bet is the code will recur unless you go to stock or get the fault masked in the tune.

With no tune you'll likely get a slew of cat inefficiency and post cat O2 sensor faults. I don't know how badly it'll affect drivability, but given the sensitivity of this engine's PCM software, I'd be extremely cautious.

^this is all really good information.

OP, as stated in my earlier PM today, i have not personally run across this issue.

The best thing to do, would be to datalog the car to check the A/F ratio and other operating parameters to ensure they are accurate and correct. From there, if the tune accuracy is confirmed, it would be a good idea to troubleshoot the car mechanically.


Have you checked for air leaks in the intake system? Are all your intake and exhaust(I know you checked the exhaust) proper and tight? Normally, if a code such as that is coming up and the car is having idle surging/hunting issues, it is likely there is a small leak somewhere. I would suggest smoke-testing the intake/exhaust systems and if that doesn't work, try pressure-testing the intake system.


I hope this helps! Please don't forget to give our Tuning Specialists a call or shoot them an email if you aren't familiar with how to datalog or if you have any specific questions related to your tune!

Good luck! Please let me know if I can be of assistance in the future!
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:18 AM   #24
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Mileage will vary.

Catless will cause a code. This isn't a secret. The tune simply turns off the 02 sensors. You can literally do it yourself.
I'm aware of how to clear codes. But I am curious as to how it has taken 2 months of daily driving for it to realize it was catless and to throw a code.

When I switched tunes, I did not clear the code. It has been over a week since this happened and I have yet to see the code again.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:20 AM   #25
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I'm aware of how to clear codes. But I am curious as to how it has taken 2 months of daily driving for it to realize it was catless and to throw a code.

When I switched tunes, I did not clear the code. It has been over a week since this happened and I have yet to see the code again.
Read my last post before your most recent reply for a little more info and I wasn't suggesting to CLEAR the code. I was suggesting to turn off the 02 which is what most tunes simply do, which you can do yourself. This is not CLEARING the code.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:26 AM   #26
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Borii is correct. I swapped my stock h pipe out to the pypes off road H last year without adding the tune and it took about a month and a half for the code to finally pop up. In fact it didn't come up until the trip to NMRA in Bowling Green. A friend of mine with an 03 Mach 1 changed his out around the same time and his was on within the day.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:26 AM   #27
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I informed BAMA that I had an off road x-pipe when I requested the revised tune. With the BAMA tunes, you cannot change options. You get what they give you. My VMP tune gives me all kinds of options when I load it. Rev limiter, idle speed, tire size, gear ratio, etc. That still does not answer the question why it didn't show up immediately after I turned the car on and started driving, but waited 12 hours and several drives later.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:29 AM   #28
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All the tunes do is disable the rear o2 sensors which monitor the performance of the catylist. The front sensors monitor A/F ratio. It should not throw a code for lean condidtion on either front sensor because the cats are removed. Either way i would still have them disabled to keep it from throwing a code for the rears being out of acceptable limits.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:33 AM   #29
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Borii is correct. I swapped my stock h pipe out to the pypes off road H last year without adding the tune and it took about a month and a half for the code to finally pop up. In fact it didn't come up until the trip to NMRA in Bowling Green. A friend of mine with an 03 Mach 1 changed his out around the same time and his was on within the day.
You shouldnt get a code for front o2 sensor or catalyst deficiency from removing the cats. I have a 06 camry i took the cats off of in 07 and used spark arrestors on the rear o2 sensors and it has never thrown a code. I have had three other mustangs none had cats, only one had tune and none of them threw a code from front o2 or lean condition. only rear o2 sensor or catalyst deficiency.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:33 AM   #30
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I informed BAMA that I had an off road x-pipe when I requested the revised tune. With the BAMA tunes, you cannot change options. You get what they give you. My VMP tune gives me all kinds of options when I load it. Rev limiter, idle speed, tire size, gear ratio, etc. That still does not answer the question why it didn't show up immediately after I turned the car on and started driving, but waited 12 hours and several drives later.
I am not trying to be rude here. You asked for suggestions but it seems like you're looking for a specific answer.

1 - 02 code from an off road pipe can come and go forever and ever amen.

2 - Took weeks most likely due to many varying factors. Literally including weather coupled with driving habits. If the 02 didn't feel it saw that much exhaust/velocity or whatever, it will remain "satisfied" so the code stays off.

3 - Telling bama you had an off road x pipe doesn't mean anything. They could have easily rushed through and forgot. It happens, a lot. I literally had dozens of Bama tunes and at least a half dozen needed parameters re adjusted or they simply forgot.

4 - I could adjust any parameter in my bama tune as you stated in the VMP tune. I haven't had a 3V in 7 months though so unless something changed in the last 7 months, you can change the bama tune.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:36 AM   #31
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I informed BAMA that I had an off road x-pipe when I requested the revised tune. With the BAMA tunes, you cannot change options. You get what they give you. My VMP tune gives me all kinds of options when I load it. Rev limiter, idle speed, tire size, gear ratio, etc. That still does not answer the question why it didn't show up immediately after I turned the car on and started driving, but waited 12 hours and several drives later.
Well im on your side here man. But sometimes some codes take a little time or few driving cycles to show up. Some things are only checked under certian driving/running conditions.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:37 AM   #32
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All the tunes do is disable the rear o2 sensors which monitor the performance of the catylist. The front sensors monitor A/F ratio. It should not throw a code for lean condidtion on either front sensor because the cats are removed. Either way i would still have them disabled to keep it from throwing a code for the rears being out of acceptable limits.
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You shouldnt get a code for front o2 sensor or catalyst deficiency from removing the cats. I have a 06 camry i took the cats off of in 07 and used spark arrestors on the rear o2 sensors and it has never thrown a code. I have had three other mustangs none had cats, only one had tune and none of them threw a code from front o2 or lean condition. only rear o2 sensor or catalyst deficiency.
You can easily google dozens of threads where his code was solved with a revised tune or simply turning off the 02. The front code is caused usually by chain reaction. This is not a guarantee obviously but it is entirely possible and google will show you that.

All tunes are SUPPOSED to turn off the 02 as you stated but it can be missed. This thread though has probably received enough attention now and bama will hopefully take care of him. Then he can track test both tunes for us for comparable track data
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:39 AM   #33
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I am not trying to be rude here. You asked for suggestions but it seems like you're looking for a specific answer.

1 - 02 code from an off road pipe can come and go forever and ever amen.

2 - Took weeks most likely due to many varying factors. Literally including weather coupled with driving habits. If the 02 didn't feel it saw that much exhaust/velocity or whatever, it will remain "satisfied" so the code stays off.

3 - Telling bama you had an off road x pipe doesn't mean anything. They could have easily rushed through and forgot. It happens, a lot. I literally had dozens of Bama tunes and at least a half dozen needed parameters re adjusted or they simply forgot.

4 - I could adjust any parameter in my bama tune as you stated in the VMP tune. I haven't had a 3V in 7 months though so unless something changed in the last 7 months, you can change the bama tune.
1- Thats correct

2-Thats correct

3- Bama tunes and customer service suck!

4- I couldnt adjust anything on my bama tunes either when i had them.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:42 AM   #34
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4- I couldnt adjust anything on my bama tunes either when i had them.
I don't get that. I would adjust my limiter and tire size as I tried different wheels, tires and limiters for shifting. All at the track.
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Old 04-15-2014, 09:43 AM   #35
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With the VMP, I select the tune and it asks if I want to keep or change options. When I select any of the BAMA tunes, it goes straight to the load screen. If I go to "Options" on the main screen, it only gives me one option for something called "KAM". What am I missing here?

I'll try calling BAMA again with my order number and do this over the phone. Hopefully figure out why I can't fiddle with any options.
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