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Old 07-31-2014, 09:56 PM   #1
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Any 2014 owners declined by AED?

Just talked with Shaun at AED about tuning my 2014, and he informed me that he has turned away 75% of the 2014's he has been asked to remotely tune due to timing/knock issues. Does anyone have more info on this?

Also, I had a chance to read a review of AED tuning that showed their datalog requirements. There are 2 logs needed:
1. Part throttle in 3rd from 1100 - 5000 rpm
2. WOT in 5th from 2000 - redline

My car has 3.73 gears, but redline in 5th has to be pretty damn fast. While a chassis dyno is recommended and preferred, my question is, if you need to use a dyno for datalogging, why not just go with a dyno tune and save the $400 for the tuner? Has anyone run these datalogs on the street?
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Old 08-01-2014, 01:10 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hispeedlodrag View Post
Just talked with Shaun at AED about tuning my 2014, and he informed me that he has turned away 75% of the 2014's he has been asked to remotely tune due to timing/knock issues. Does anyone have more info on this?

Also, I had a chance to read a review of AED tuning that showed their datalog requirements. There are 2 logs needed:
1. Part throttle in 3rd from 1100 - 5000 rpm
2. WOT in 5th from 2000 - redline

My car has 3.73 gears, but redline in 5th has to be pretty damn fast. While a chassis dyno is recommended and preferred, my question is, if you need to use a dyno for datalogging, why not just go with a dyno tune and save the $400 for the tuner? Has anyone run these datalogs on the street?
Wow... 5th at redline is like 140-145mph I think right?
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Old 08-01-2014, 01:49 AM   #3
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Good god my car has 3.15s. I don't have a road long enough to top it out in 5th and worry about not getting pulled
Over.


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Old 08-01-2014, 06:22 AM   #4
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With 3.15 gears I was going 150 at 4000rpm in 5th gear


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Old 08-01-2014, 06:42 AM   #5
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I'm tuned by AED. The WOT log can be done in 3rd or 4th gear.
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:44 AM   #6
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I assume you did your log on the street? How fast was redline in 4th? My car is brand new - have not pushed it yet...
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:46 AM   #7
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I assume you did your log on the street? How fast was redline in 4th? My car is brand new - I have not pushed it yet...

Has anyone heard about timing/knock issues with the 14's?
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:00 AM   #8
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Did he mention this timing/knock issue is in the 13s too? I don't think anything really changed from 13-14 so would be good to know.


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Old 08-01-2014, 07:00 AM   #9
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Yes I logged on the street. With my 3.73s, stock redline (7500 rpm) in 3rd is around upper 80s. 4th is in mid 120s. The redline is increased after you log with the base tune. A GT has a lower red line tho. I logged in 3rd, as it was much easier and safer on the street than using 4th.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:02 AM   #10
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I had knock issues with initial pre tune logging, but bad fuel was the cause.
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:13 AM   #11
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Bad Fuel was the cause of the "concern" on my '13 before we really started tuning as well. Switched over to shell and have yet to have any concerns from him, he actually told me i could turn my global timing up 1*. I also do my logs in 3rd, i just snag a full 3rd gear pull at the track friday nights during test and tune.
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Old 08-01-2014, 09:06 AM   #12
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Did he mention this timing/knock issue is in the 13s too? I don't think anything really changed from 13-14 so would be good to know.


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He mentioned that Ford made a change on the 14's knock sensor, I believe. No issues noted on the 13's.
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Old 08-01-2014, 09:12 AM   #13
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Bad Fuel was the cause of the "concern" on my '13 before we really started tuning as well. Switched over to shell and have yet to have any concerns from him, he actually told me i could turn my global timing up 1*. I also do my logs in 3rd, i just snag a full 3rd gear pull at the track friday nights during test and tune.
I have been using non-oxygenated 91 octane - I wonder if I should change back to 93 octane oxygenated for the datalog?
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Old 08-01-2014, 10:23 AM   #14
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Good to know. Thanks for the heads up


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Old 08-01-2014, 02:55 PM   #15
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Datalogging on the street is the way to go IMHO. That is REAL world conditions on your motor. We are remotely tuned by Jon LUND and could not be happier. He in fact will ask for MANY more than the two logs you mention that AED asks for. We are FI but here is how our logging session went.
1)Sent a base tune
2)Neutral Rev Data Log. Car not moving, series of neutral revs and holds at specified RPM's
3)Revisions sent and loaded
4)Neutral Rev Log again
5)Revision sent, loaded
6)Street Logs (2500-5000 pulls 3rd gear)
7) Revisions sent and loaded
8)Street WOT pulls (2500-7200)
9)Revisions sent and loaded
10)Repeat WOT pulls to 7200 and revisions until he gets it perfect

The entire process took one half of a day. You are logged on to a site he has and once you send you datalog file, he would respond with a revised tune in 30min or so. I am SO impressed and our dynograph backs up how good the tune is. The car runs beautifully, and performs even better. This process is a better process IMHO than putting a car on rollers and going WOT. If you ran your car WOT 100% of the time, maybe, but the majority of the time you are driving the car in a totally different rpm range and the load on your motor is different than the load it has on rollers.
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Old 08-01-2014, 04:37 PM   #16
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I hope my 2014 will be tuneable since aed is the only tuner i know that can and will change the values for rear o2 sensors, so you can run long tubes and pass readiness emissions.
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Old 08-01-2014, 05:09 PM   #17
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I hope my 2014 will be tuneable since aed is the only tuner i know that can and will change the values for rear o2 sensors, so you can run long tubes and pass readiness emissions.
Mike Rousch, VMP, and Lund can also do this. Maybe more but these I know for sure.
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Old 08-01-2014, 05:56 PM   #18
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did not notice that lund could also do this. Thanx for the info. I do like the data logging of lunds tune, makes most the sense when it come to making sure your tune performance at its best. how reliable is lund over aed? I know there is mixed results all over the place on the net.
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:27 PM   #19
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I would have no problem running a Lund tune. He is a helicopter pilot first and a tuner second but is still a heck of a good tuner.
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Old 08-01-2014, 06:38 PM   #20
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Just recently got a Lund tune on my 14' gt. It was in within a day and it has definitely changed my car!!


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Old 08-01-2014, 07:08 PM   #21
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did not notice that lund could also do this. Thanx for the info. I do like the data logging of lunds tune, makes most the sense when it come to making sure your tune performance at its best. how reliable is lund over aed? I know there is mixed results all over the place on the net.
How did you come to the conclusion that Lund is more reliable than AED? Shaun's (AED) reputation is stellar. His tunes are powerful, with perfect driveability, and reliable. Lunds more detailed data log process, as stated above, applies to forced induction tuning. For NA tunes, only the two part throttle and wot data logs (with the properly monitored parameters) are needed to produce a fantastic tune
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Old 08-01-2014, 07:48 PM   #22
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f you need to use a dyno for datalogging, why not just go with a dyno tune and save the $400 for the tuner?
fyi, you still need to buy a tuner, the shop will write the tune off the information gotten from numerous dyno pulls, they then have to transfer the tune to your tuner, then flash the tune to your ecm



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Old 08-01-2014, 09:09 PM   #23
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i did not say it was more reliable than aed. Its seems like there data logging process would be better as far as making sure everything is reliable. I was just asking if one seemed more better than the other just because of this. I heard a lot of good things about aed which is why i wanted to go with them in the first place. Just trying to figure out my options since this topic came up with the 2014 knock sensors being different. Also i need a emissions too since chicago sux, but i still want a aed tune since all i hear are great things.
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Old 08-01-2014, 09:21 PM   #24
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A friend of mine used AED in the past. AED requires the initial two logs, and then sends a base tune based on your mods. Like Lund, additional logs are used to dial in the tune. For NA applications, three logs is normally sufficient.
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Old 08-01-2014, 09:53 PM   #25
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Odd you guys say that about Lund wanting logs. When I asked if he wanted logs he said no. No logs before or after.

I spoke with Shaun and he demands logs period.


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Old 08-01-2014, 10:37 PM   #26
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I'm not positive of this, but I believe that for NA tunes, Lund does not request logs, but will review them if the customer insists. Trust me, try AED. I'm more than satisfied with his tunes and level of service. There are numerous positive reviews of AED tunes at the Svtperformance forum that will give you a good idea of what you can expect.
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Old 08-01-2014, 11:05 PM   #27
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thank you for your response and info.
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Old 08-02-2014, 08:01 AM   #28
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I put the Lund email tune in my car. I can monitor everything with SCT livewire. There were zero data logs between us and the tune is 100% spot on. My car runs 1000% better than stock or with my previous tune. I personally don't have much time with 2 jobs and 2 small kids to be playing around with datalogging. Go Lund if you want to DL and move on. I have a '13 and so does my friend. We both went his route and both tunes are the same. Flawless.
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Old 08-02-2014, 09:26 AM   #29
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Have just the knock sensors changed? Maybe change them out with a older 11-13 sensor.

I'm sure Sean is working on it. I doubt he will just sit there and let someone else figure this one out.

JMHO

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Old 08-02-2014, 01:32 PM   #30
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2011 Ford Mustang GT 5.0 Coyote Engine - 5.0 Mustang & Fast Fords

Older but good read.

M5lp 1003 46 O+50 Coyote Engine+five Casting Cores - Photo 26518748 - 2011 Ford Mustang GT 5.0 Coyote Engine - 5.0 Mustang & Fast Fords

Coyote Engine Pictures again good read older article.

Ford has had problems with water pumps making noise on the new 5.0L. Here is a tsb and if you remove the belt and noise goes away it says replace coolant pump.

Printable View (2473 KB) TSB
12-3-1
  • 5.0L - INTERMITTENT METALLIC RATTLE OR SCRATCHING TYPE NOISE - WARM ENGINE AT IDLE
Publication Date: March 2, 2012
FORD:
2011-2012 Mustang, F-150


This article supersedes TSB 11-12-12 to update the Service Procedure and warranty causal part number. ISSUE:

Some 2011-2012 F-150 and Mustang vehicles (excluding Boss) equipped with a 5.0L engine may exhibit an intermittent metallic rattle or scratching type noise in the area at the front of the left hand or driver side cylinder head at idle with the engine at operating temperature.
ACTION:

Follow the Service Procedure steps to correct the condition.
SERVICE PROCEDURE

  1. <li itxtharvested="0" itxtnodeid="508">Determine engine build date. Refer to Workshop Manual (WSM), Section 303-01.
    1. <li itxtharvested="0" itxtnodeid="511">If engine build date is on or before 11/10/2011, proceed to Step 2.
    2. If engine build date is on or after 11/11/2011, do not continue with this procedure. Refer to the WSM, Section 303-00 for normal diagnostics.
    <li itxtharvested="0" itxtnodeid="507">Warm the engine to operating temperature. <li itxtharvested="0" itxtnodeid="506">Using a mechanic's stethoscope or EngineEAR, listen for a metallic type rattle or scratching type noise at the front of LH cylinder head. <li itxtharvested="0" itxtnodeid="505">Is the noise heard in areas shown? (Figures 1 and 2)

    Report this image
    Figure 1 - Article 12-3-1



    Report this image
    Figure 2 - Article 12-3-1
    1. <li itxtharvested="0" itxtnodeid="526">Yes - Proceed to Step 5.
    2. No - This article does not apply.
    <li itxtharvested="0" itxtnodeid="504">Remove accessory drive belt, refer to WSM, Section 303-05. Is noise still present?
    1. <li itxtharvested="0" itxtnodeid="529">Yes - Proceed to Step 6.
    2. No - Replace the coolant pump. Refer to WSM, Section 303-03A.
    <li itxtharvested="0" itxtnodeid="503">Is the noise heard in the areas shown? (Figures 1 and 2)
    1. Yes - Replace the LH primary tensioner and timing chain tensioner arm using the kit part number provided in this article. Refer to WSM, Section 303-01B.
    2. No - This article does not apply. Refer to WSM, Section 303-00 for normal diagnostics.
      NOTE:FAILURE TO REPLACE BOTH THE PRIMARY TENSIONER AND TIMING CHAIN TENSIONER ARM MAY RESULT IN OVERLOADING OF THE TIMING CHAIN AND UNDER CERTAIN CONDITIONS COULD LEAD TO TIMING CHAIN FAILURE.
PART NUMBERPART NAMEBR3Z-6L266-AAChain Tensioner KitZC-30Motorcraft® Silicone Gasket RemoverZC-31-AMotorcraft® Metal Surface PrepTA-30Motorcraft® Silicone Gasket And SealantBR3Z-8255-AThermostat SealF1VY-8507-AWater Pump GasketBR3Z-6A340-ACrankshaft BoltBR3Z-6020-BFront Cover Gasket - LeftBR3Z-6020-CFront Cover Gasket - CenterBR3Z-6020-DFront Cover Gasket - RightBR3Z-6584-AValve Cover Gasket - LeftBR3Z-6584-DValve Cover Gasket - RightBR3Z-8620-AA/C Stretchy BeltBR3Z-8501-HWater Pump

WARRANTY STATUS:

Eligible Under Provisions Of New Vehicle Limited Warranty Coverage
IMPORTANT: Warranty/ESP coverage limits/policies/prior approvals are not altered by a TSB. Warranty/ESP coverage limits are determined by the identified causal part and verified using the OASIS part coverage tool.
OPERATIONDESCRIPTIONTIME120301A2011-2012 F-150 5.0L: Replace The Coolant Pump Includes Time To Diagnose (Do Not Use With Any Other Labor Operations)1.5 Hrs.120301A2011-2012 Mustang 5.0L: Replace The Coolant Pump Includes Time To Diagnose (Do Not Use With Any Other Labor Operations)1.7 Hrs.120301B2011-2012 F-150 5.0L: Replace The LH Timing Chain Tensioner And Tensioner Arm Includes Time To Diagnose (Do Not Use With Any Other Labor Operations)5.3 Hrs.120301B2011-2012 Mustang 5.0L: Replace The LH Timing Chain Tensioner And Tensioner Arm Includes Time To Diagnose (Do Not Use With Any Other Labor Operations)5.4 Hrs.
DEALER CODING

BASIC PART NO.CONDITION CODE850142
NOTE: The information in Technical Service Bulletins is intended for use by trained, professional technicians with the knowledge, tools, and equipment to do the job properly and safely. It informs these technicians of conditions that may occur on some vehicles, or provides information that could assist in proper vehicle service. The procedures should not be performed by "do-it-yourselfers". Do not assume that a condition described affects your car or truck. Contact a Ford or Lincoln dealership to determine whether the Bulletin applies to your vehicle. Warranty Policy and Extended Service Plan documentation determine Warranty and/or Extended Service Plan coverage unless stated otherwise in the TSB article. The information in this Technical Service Bulletin (TSB) was current at the time of printing. Ford Motor Company reserves the right to supercede this information with updates. The most recent information is available through Ford Motor Company's on-line technical resources.
Copyright © 2012 Ford Motor Company
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Old 08-04-2014, 05:20 PM   #31
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Update from OP:
After running the data logs on 91 octane non-oxygenated gas, spark levels were very low, but with no knock. Shaun recommended changing fuel brands to a top-tier vendor, so I switched to BP 93 octane and repeated the logs. The difference was substantial, and Shaun accepted the car for tuning. Makes you think twice about fuel quality...
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Old 12-18-2015, 10:08 PM   #32
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Update from OP:
After running the data logs on 91 octane non-oxygenated gas, spark levels were very low, but with no knock. Shaun recommended changing fuel brands to a top-tier vendor, so I switched to BP 93 octane and repeated the logs. The difference was substantial, and Shaun accepted the car for tuning. Makes you think twice about fuel quality...
Any advice on how to find out what tier of Gas is in use at station?

93 Octane is not available in my state, but I do buy real gas only. (no ethanol)
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Old 12-19-2015, 12:45 PM   #33
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Wow... 5th at redline is like 140-145mph I think right?




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Old 12-19-2015, 12:57 PM   #34
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Any advice on how to find out what tier of Gas is in use at station?

93 Octane is not available in my state, but I do buy real gas only. (no ethanol)
Look on the Internet. The "mom and pop" stations will likely not carry the top-tier fuels.

I tried 91 non-ethanol (non-oxygenated), and the fuel was so poor that Shaun would not proceed with tuning until I changed. Even if the fuel is fresh, I doubt that any reputable tuner will tune your car for it. My local dyno tuner has told me that the ethanol allows for much for timing versus non-oxy. This is why E85 allows for more timing versus 93 oxygenated.

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Old 12-19-2015, 01:09 PM   #35
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Definitely an issue. On my last car, a '12 car with a Vortech, the car ran so bad even on top tier fuels where I am, like Chevron 94 that you'd think it wasn't supercharged. When the fuel was compensated for the car made mad power right away.

For my current late '14car without a blower, I had VMP set it up for 87, 91 and 93 n/a and I run the 91 tune currently. That seems to be a-ok thus far.

Fuel can be crap even from the best brands.
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