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Old 03-14-2016, 02:19 PM   #1
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Track mods are complete...for now

So track season for me starts March 26.
I've got some new suspension parts and brake lines that should help at the track.
Stop tech stainless steel brake lines with Motul 660 fluid was completed two weeks ago. Prior to that I did SR Swaybar end links. After some Canyon driving they both came loose. I'll have to go back and put some blue Loctite on those.
The last thing I installed was the BMR A arms with extended ball joints. I think these will make a big difference, my old inner bushings were worn. In addition, these things are 11+ pounds lighter.
Anybody else have similar mods? If so, how do you like them?


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Old 03-14-2016, 02:20 PM   #2
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Old 03-14-2016, 04:42 PM   #3
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I have been looking at those A arms. I know you are asking people about them but did you feel a big difference yet?
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Old 03-14-2016, 05:20 PM   #4
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I haven't pulled the car out of the garage yet after installing them.
The first thing I need to do is take it to get an alignment and bump steer adjustment. That will be mid to late this week.


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Old 03-15-2016, 01:11 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redonblackpony View Post
I haven't pulled the car out of the garage yet after installing them.
The first thing I need to do is take it to get an alignment and bump steer adjustment. That will be mid to late this week.


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An alignment shop will not be able to do a proper bump steer adjustment.
I've been over this a zillion times and frankly don't want to do it again but trust me when I tell you. The process is long and complicated and they will not have the right equipment or know how to do it. Period. Anybody who tells you otherwise is either lying to you or ignorant of the facts.
All you can do is set the tie rod angle as close to the angle of the control arm as you can and hope for the best. The alignment shop can set the toe, camber, caster and check the thrust angle but not bump steer no matter what anybody tells you. The answer is nope.
So get that angle as close to parallel to the control arm angle as you can before taking it to the alignment shop because that's as good as it's gonna get unless you take it to a proper race shop with a real bump steer gauge and the know how to do it for real.
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Old 03-15-2016, 01:39 PM   #6
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Here you go, check it out:
Do I have everything I need for lowering
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Old 03-15-2016, 02:10 PM   #7
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Some examples of how subtle differences in angles drastically affect bump steer:







So you can see that the old line of "Just Set the tie rod angle the same angle as the control arm to set the bumpsteer" is nothing more than BS to get you to buy parts and hope that you don't know the difference. You CANNOT properly set bump steer this way. Read the link I sent you, there is another link in there to an article that tells the truth on the subject that is very good AND ACCURATE.....take the time to check it out.
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Old 03-15-2016, 06:11 PM   #8
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I hope that you are wrong. The place I'm going is a high-performance alignment shop with the biggest rack anywhere I know of. The shop manager is quite aware of bumpsteer and the Steeda product I use.
There is of course no guarantee that will he will set up perfectly. I fully understand the process and what it takes to set bumpsteer. I've studied it and fully understand it. It takes a special rack to accomplish this and it is a trial and error procedure. I only wish that I could be present when they do the procedure.
I've talk to manufacturers and they tell me the same thing, a good starting point is to have the tie rod end parallel to the control arm.
At least I know he can set caster and camber and toe in.
The bottom line for me is that I want to keep the toe in more in than out when the suspension dampens


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Old 03-15-2016, 06:54 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redonblackpony View Post
I hope that you are wrong. The place I'm going is a high-performance alignment shop with the biggest rack anywhere I know of. The shop manager is quite aware of bumpsteer and the Steeda product I use.
There is of course no guarantee that will he will set up perfectly. I fully understand the process and what it takes to set bumpsteer. I've studied it and fully understand it. It takes a special rack to accomplish this and it is a trial and error procedure. I only wish that I could be present when they do the procedure.
I've talk to manufacturers and they tell me the same thing, a good starting point is to have the tie rod end parallel to the control arm.
At least I know he can set caster and camber and toe in.
The bottom line for me is that I want to keep the toe in more in than out when the suspension dampens


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Then you are aware that the springs have to be removed to do this...right?
It can NOT be done properly otherwise. Not.
And you want toe in statically for the street and a very small amount of toe out on bump. .015/inch or so.

I would be shocked if they did this correctly...I would insist on being present if I were you. Manufacturers tell you to set the arms parallel because that's all they can say. There is no correct way to do it with out doing it correctly, and they want you to buy parts. The pics I provided show you this. If you read the links I provided you will understand why this matters. And no, I am not wrong. I designed and built some of the fastest stock cars in the western states for a very long time with records and championships across the western states. I have correctly bumped easily over 100 cars. I know what I am talking about, I provided you the correct information and have nothing to gain and nothing to sell you. I am telling you the real story. Be glad somebody is being honest with you. This is NOT a trial and error procedure....it is geometry and can be set correctly if it is done correctly. Otherwise you are just pissing in the wind
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Old 03-15-2016, 07:38 PM   #10
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Looks to me like he will be setting caster and camber and toe in.
I've never heard of removing the springs to set bump steer? That's news to me


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Old 03-15-2016, 08:52 PM   #11
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Looks to me like he will be setting caster and camber and toe in.
I've never heard of removing the springs to set bump steer? That's news to me


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That is the only way to do it. Look at the information I provided...its all in there.
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Old 03-15-2016, 08:57 PM   #12
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check this out, it will answer all your questions:
Bump Steer Tips
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Old 03-15-2016, 08:58 PM   #13
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This is a bump steer gauge.
See how he has a jack under the control arm? He is jacking the suspension through travel and taking measurements. You need the spring out to do this.

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Old 03-15-2016, 09:15 PM   #14
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I read it and don't understand a good deal of it. But I do understand it is a complicated thing to set.
I have seen different methods to set bumpsteer. The article I just read is for a straight up racecar. And by the way, it looks like the spring is still in the car


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Old 03-15-2016, 10:18 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redonblackpony View Post
I read it and don't understand a good deal of it. But I do understand it is a complicated thing to set.
I have seen different methods to set bumpsteer. The article I just read is for a straight up racecar. And by the way, it looks like the spring is still in the car


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Can't do it with the spring in the car. No way to jack the suspension through several inches of travel to plot the curve.
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Old 03-15-2016, 10:27 PM   #16
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I'd listen to him if I were you.


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Old 03-15-2016, 10:50 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Redonblackpony View Post
Anybody else have similar mods? If so, how do you like them?


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Track season starts for me the same weekend and I'm ready to rumble!

BMR makes great stuff: (my drag race tires on here)


Cortex Coilovers:


6 piston Baers w/14" rotors all 4 corners:
(Konis before I went to Cortex Coilovers)


Cortex Coilovers front:


Cortex Coilovers rear:
(you can just see part of the verticle slot of the Steeda roll center adjustable panhard bar mount behind the sway bar-Steeda makes some fine pieces as well)
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Old 03-15-2016, 11:39 PM   #18
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Good luck to you then.
Don't break anything! Oh wait, that always happens in racing


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Old 03-16-2016, 12:14 AM   #19
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Good luck to you then.
Don't break anything! Oh wait, that always happens in racing


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The more stuff I break the better I get at fixing. haha.
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Old 04-23-2016, 07:45 PM   #20
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Here you go...the TRUTH:

I finally took the time to install a Steeda bump steer kit and extended ball joints on my 06 Mustang GT.
I thought it would be interesting to check the bump stock, then with the extended ball joints and bump steer kit just thrown on there like most people do, then with the tie rods set parallel to the control arms like many suggest and then done up right with a proper bump steer gauge.
I'm making a how to video with all the information but the short answer is this:

1) Stock is actually pretty damn good for a production car.
2) Ball joints and bump kit thrown on-no gauge is beyond terrible. Don't be that guy.
3) Tie rods set parallel to the control arms is also terrible, but much better than not trying at all.
4) Setting it properly: Priceless.

Check it out:
Bump kit thrown on, no gauge used:
https://www.facebook.com/MauiSal/vid...33931699978189

Bump steer set with a proper bump steer gauge:
https://www.facebook.com/MauiSal/vid...83588659084186

Now you know the truth....you're welcome.
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