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Old 05-18-2015, 06:57 PM   #106
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Yea sounds like cnn news now


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Old 05-18-2015, 07:07 PM   #107
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On a side note the challenger thread is doing well...
Oh great now they'll troll that thread too, crap.


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Old 05-19-2015, 12:23 AM   #108
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After that reveal I think that mustang needs to cut some weight down now.
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Old 05-19-2015, 01:47 AM   #109
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The Mustang has more potential, which is its best virtue. It needs to shed enough weight to keep the number competitive, and tweak the suspension for better handling. But for many, the Mustang is the lower cost masterpiece. Only a small portion of drivers want to seriously race their cars. Around 50% of the cars are just basic daily drivers with panache. For the Mustang enthusiasts, there are more dedicated manufacturers of custom parts, more custom builders, and more organizations for owners. Show me the Shelby, Roush, Steeda for Camaro. Show me the MCA for Camaro.

The Camaro and Mustang may compete for buyers, but Mustang owners are more involved with their cars. Do most people realize that the entire original four generations of Camaros and Firebirds were built on the same chassis. They just kept getting more bloated and uglier with each generation (my opinion). Ford concentrated on making the Mustang relevant. And it was the enormous success of the 05-09 Mustangs that made the Camaro and Challenger relevant again. And that, in turn, made the 5.0 and 3.7 possible. It also gave Ford the push to build the 2015 with many of its virtues. It is a constant competition with few losers.
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Old 05-19-2015, 06:59 AM   #110
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The Mustang has more potential, which is its best virtue. It needs to shed enough weight to keep the number competitive, and tweak the suspension for better handling. But for many, the Mustang is the lower cost masterpiece. Only a small portion of drivers want to seriously race their cars. Around 50% of the cars are just basic daily drivers with panache. For the Mustang enthusiasts, there are more dedicated manufacturers of custom parts, more custom builders, and more organizations for owners. Show me the Shelby, Roush, Steeda for Camaro. Show me the MCA for Camaro.

The Camaro and Mustang may compete for buyers, but Mustang owners are more involved with their cars. Do most people realize that the entire original four generations of Camaros and Firebirds were built on the same chassis. They just kept getting more bloated and uglier with each generation (my opinion). Ford concentrated on making the Mustang relevant. And it was the enormous success of the 05-09 Mustangs that made the Camaro and Challenger relevant again. And that, in turn, made the 5.0 and 3.7 possible. It also gave Ford the push to build the 2015 with many of its virtues. It is a constant competition with few losers.
Well said. Chevy gave up on the Camaro.
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Old 05-19-2015, 07:31 AM   #111
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There are die hard Chevy fans

These people will buy a Camaro or Corvette (If they have the $$$$) no mater what.
They will never buy a Ford product.
*********************************THEN**************************************************
You have people like me that just likes cars. I have had many-many brands of cars over the years. American and foreign. If it appealed to me I got it.
I have had a 1964 Mustang convertible (Bought New)
A 1965 Mustang 271 HP hi-Pro ( Bought New)
a 1967 Mustang leather seat luxury Mustang ( Bought new)
**********************************Thru the years************************************
Corvettes
Hemi Plymouth's and a Dodge
Camaro -1969 Z28
Fords
Chevy's
3000GT ( Loved this car)
Porsche (Hated this car)
Mini JCW ( Loved this car)
**********************************NOW*********************************************
I'm back to a Mustang and it is the absolute best, most fun, enjoyable car I have had in a long time. Even if the new Camaro did not have the second most ugly front end in the world ( Lexis is #1 for ugly front end) and out performed all the Mustangs, I probably would stick to my Mustangs.
Any Mustang just seems to be a true 100% American Icon that all generations seem to love and share stories about.
I have more strangers coming up to me in parking lots just to talk about Mustangs they had or knew of in their past. I never had this with any other car I have owned.
The Challenger is great, It is a true old style "MUSCLE CAR" A car like this will always have a following. I like them a lot but not enough to switch over.
**************************************YES********************************************
There is something for everybody now a days. All are good if that is what you want. Most are affordable and some are crazy expensive (Z28--Corvettes-Shelby's Etc) But all are great performance cars. I don't track or race anymore but do go to car shows and cruise-in's. I belong to a Muscle car club as well as a Mustang Club along with MCA. With the Muscle car club I meet people with all types of American Muscle cars of all brands. No matter what they own, They all seem to like a Mustang. Even my Street rod friends I do breakfast cruises with like my Mustang. I don't think there is a better car to own for a "CAR GUY or GIRL.
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Old 05-19-2015, 04:03 PM   #112
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The Mustang has more potential, which is its best virtue. It needs to shed enough weight to keep the number competitive, and tweak the suspension for better handling. But for many, the Mustang is the lower cost masterpiece. Only a small portion of drivers want to seriously race their cars. Around 50% of the cars are just basic daily drivers with panache. For the Mustang enthusiasts, there are more dedicated manufacturers of custom parts, more custom builders, and more organizations for owners. Show me the Shelby, Roush, Steeda for Camaro. Show me the MCA for Camaro.
Ford was rumored to shed up to 400lbs., but it didn't happen for the 15, but it probably will in a model year or so. My feeling is that they got bogged down with the IRS and spent the resources on it. Apparently there are still a few problems, but they should be able to tweak it after a year of real world abuse.

I agree with your assessment of the Camaro, it's competition, but always trying to keep up. I think the 16's are horrible, the interior is probably the best part.

The biggest enemy of the Camaro has always been the Corvette. Chevy is always scared to cannibalize vette sales if the Camaro gets to be too powerful. Which is really stupid, if someone has the cash for a vette and wants one, they are going to get a vette.
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Old 05-19-2015, 04:32 PM   #113
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I agree that people will not buy a Camaro if they want a Corvette no matter how fast it is. Remember in the 60's when you could buy a 396ci Nova or a 396ci Corvette. I doubt that Nova's were deterring Corvette sales. I believe Ford is making the same mistake. They will not push the horsepower in the GT up over 450 for fear people will not buy the GT350. I say let me buy any engine in the GT that I want, especially the new Voodoo. Set the GT350 up for track racing to distinguish it from the GT. Whatever you loose in GT350 sales would be more than made up in stealing customers from Chevy and Chrysler. But I'm sure Ford has done market studies and does not agree. So event though I had my heart set on a new 2016GT I'm not going to buy one until the up the HP and torque.
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Old 05-20-2015, 12:57 AM   #114
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There are limits to how much HP can realistically be gained on an engine, and sometimes it is an issue of going with the more practical motor or going with the highest numbers. Since Ford is getting 440 HP from a 5.0L and GM is getting just a little more than that from a 6.2L, I would say that Ford is doing the better job.
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Old 05-20-2015, 08:41 AM   #115
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There are limits to how much HP can realistically be gained on an engine, and sometimes it is an issue of going with the more practical motor or going with the highest numbers. Since Ford is getting 440 HP from a 5.0L and GM is getting just a little more than that from a 6.2L, I would say that Ford is doing the better job.
Now a days with so many different engine types you really can't say 'one has less cubic inches so its more practical' as there are so many things to consider. You could make the argument then that 'GM doesn't need a DOHC engine to make good power so their doing a better job'. At the end of the day both engines in their respective cars make around the same power and get the same MPG so they are pretty equal just different.

And I still say that at some point these GM/Ford are going to reach a point where they maximize power on the standard V8 models and begin to work on weight reduction (similar to the F150). Once that is achieved I really think your going to see the peak HP numbers drop again in an effort to increase fuel economy. Sure they will continue the HP wars with the high end models (Z/28, Shelby, etc) but I doubt you will ever see a 5-6 hundred HP GT or Camaro
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Old 05-20-2015, 09:29 AM   #116
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Now a days with so many different engine types you really can't say 'one has less cubic inches so its more practical' as there are so many things to consider. You could make the argument then that 'GM doesn't need a DOHC engine to make good power so their doing a better job'. At the end of the day both engines in their respective cars make around the same power and get the same MPG so they are pretty equal just different.

And I still say that at some point these GM/Ford are going to reach a point where they maximize power on the standard V8 models and begin to work on weight reduction (similar to the F150). Once that is achieved I really think your going to see the peak HP numbers drop again in an effort to increase fuel economy. Sure they will continue the HP wars with the high end models (Z/28, Shelby, etc) but I doubt you will ever see a 5-6 hundred HP GT or Camaro
The ZL1 has more power than the Z/28. I don't think the models matter at all. I think the hp numbers will continue to climb since there are systems like displacement on demand or the hybrid super cars with 800-900 horsepower. There are already promises of a low to mid 700 hp mustang. Who knows. It will be fun to watch either way.
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Old 05-20-2015, 09:38 AM   #117
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I was seeing on Facebook a huge number of Camaro fans just pissed that they offer a 4 cylinder in the Camaro now.
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Old 05-20-2015, 09:46 AM   #118
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I was seeing on Facebook a huge number of Camaro fans just pissed that they offer a 4 cylinder in the Camaro now.
Ask them about the commercial GM pulled off the air of two dudes washing their Camaro. That gets them real fired up.
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Old 05-20-2015, 10:43 AM   #119
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Ask them about the commercial GM pulled off the air of two dudes washing their Camaro. That gets them real fired up.
Lol

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Old 05-20-2015, 11:58 PM   #120
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Practical HP is not so much a matter of cubic inches. It is more an issue with where the power band operates and how it transitions through the power range. An interesting article about the GT350 is about the bold choices that Ford made. The success of the GT500 was overwhelming, and Ford needed to challenge the Z28. The new GT350 is almost certain to meet that goal, but the 2016 Camaro is a bigger hurdle than they had expected. It would be easy to put a blower on the 5.0 and reap a lot more power, but that would add 150+lbs. to the front end. Instead, they created a unique NA engine that is similar what Shelby did with the original GT350.
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Old 05-22-2015, 07:18 AM   #121
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http://www.boldride.com/ride/2014/ch...-z28#gallery/9

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Old 05-22-2015, 07:31 AM   #122
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Old 05-23-2015, 04:17 PM   #123
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https://www.yahoo.com/autos/news/pro...183044222.html


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Old 05-23-2015, 05:48 PM   #124
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I'll tell ya, if was going to have a Camaro as a daily, I'd want 90 IROC Z, 5spd. Not very pretty but not a bad car at all. A few mods and it'll be rocking. Not a lot of HP but a boat load of torque. Or maybe an LS swap and it would be a wicked sleeper. Don't mind me just thinking out loud.


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Old 05-23-2015, 05:54 PM   #125
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Anout 95% of The 3rd Gen camaro is the Ultimate white trash symbol. 100% true.
The 5% that isn't is the all out drag Car's.

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Old 05-23-2015, 06:01 PM   #126
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Anout 95% of The 3rd Gen camaro is the Ultimate white trash symbol. 100% true.
The 5% that isn't is the all out drag Car's.

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This ^^^^^^^^^

or ghetto. I see enough of them on donked out wheels.
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Old 05-23-2015, 06:18 PM   #127
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What next after Camaro release?

Hm, interesting, most of the 3rd gen Camaro owners around here are black. I suspect it's a regional gig. Then again there's no where near as many Camaro owners as there's Mustang owners here. I always figured the late 80s early 90s GM pick ups to be the white trash symbol.


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Old 05-23-2015, 06:22 PM   #128
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This ^^^^^^^^^

or ghetto. I see enough of them on donked out wheels.
I see this way more often than I should living in the corn fields of Indiana.

WTF is it about a 3rd gen Camaro that makes them so donkable...

I honestly can't believe I just typed that.

Seriously though... for every 10, 3rd gen Camaro's, 7 are utter piles of trailer park trash, 2 are donked/riced out and 1 will actually be well taken care of or racecar.

I want to see a donked fox body in person so bad, just so I can laugh at it...
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Old 05-23-2015, 06:23 PM   #129
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Hm, interesting, most of the 3rd gen Camaro owners around here are black. I suspect it's a regional gig. Then again there's no where near as many Camaro owners as there's Mustang owners here. I always figured the late 80s early 90s GM pick ups to be the white trash symbol.


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Down south it's the other way around. Alot of the late 80 and early 90 truck around here are either. Sitting on 26 + inch wheels or slammed down with 15 inch wheels and something wrote in spanish on the back window.

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Old 05-23-2015, 06:24 PM   #130
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I thought old style Sebring's were too


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Old 05-23-2015, 06:26 PM   #131
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What next after Camaro release?

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Down south it's the other way around. Alot of the late 80 and early 90 truck around here are either. Sitting on 26 + inch wheels or slammed down with 15 inch wheels and something wrote in spanish on the back window.

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Yea thats exactly opposite here. They are redneckified to the extreme. Or they are 30 different colors, rusted beyond reason, 4 different wheels, bullet holes, glasspacks/strait pipe, backfiring and blue smoke, bald tires, windshield cracked, and interior is just trashed.


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Old 05-23-2015, 06:34 PM   #132
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Well difference there Is ones a ghetto street tire and other is mud tire


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Old 05-23-2015, 07:52 PM   #133
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The big 3 all have their issues and their perks..

Chevy engines, i believe are nearly the easiest motors around to make stupid power... Sorry guys, 1 cam is a hell of alot easier and cheaper than 4.... lol

Dodge's are heavy like tanks, but they are coming around slowly.

Fords, have always been in the game, especially for some good sounding v8's lol.

If one of you say that the new camaro looks like the 15 mustang, i will throat punch you.


15 mustang looks more like a 2dr accord... lol
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Old 05-23-2015, 07:54 PM   #134
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Ask them about the commercial GM pulled off the air of two dudes washing their Camaro. That gets them real fired up.

worse thing is, im a chevy guy and find that funny hahah.
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Old 05-23-2015, 07:55 PM   #135
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The big 3 all have their issues and their perks..

Chevy engines, i believe are nearly the easiest motors around to make stupid power... Sorry guys, 1 cam is a hell of alot easier and cheaper than 4.... lol

Dodge's are heavy like tanks, but they are coming around slowly.

Fords, have always been in the game, especially for some good sounding v8's lol.

If one of you say that the new camaro looks like the 15 mustang, i will throat punch you.


15 mustang looks more like a 2dr accord... lol
Agree with everything except for "ford always being in the game" no they have been on the sidelines for a long time untill 2011-12. Then they are going right back to the sidelines

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Old 05-24-2015, 09:42 PM   #136
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Anout 95% of The 3rd Gen camaro is the Ultimate white trash symbol. 100% true.
The 5% that isn't is the all out drag Car's.

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Got that right lol. My buddy's dad has a f body with a built motor longtubes a stall and a 150 shot. Man it's quick. Still think I can take him though. We have rose in each other's and he says mine is faster even when he's on the bottle.


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Old 05-24-2015, 10:58 PM   #137
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Agree with everything except for "ford always being in the game" no they have been on the sidelines for a long time untill 2011-12. Then they are going right back to the sidelines

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They'll still be in the game as far as the $$$$$ omgwtfbbq performance cars but for the average person with a $25-$35k budget... dunno.
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Old 05-25-2015, 12:25 AM   #138
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How is the Mustang not in the game? Sales? Mustang has outsold the Camaro every year except 77-78, 82-85, 91, 10-11, 13. That is 10 out of 50 years. 41 years if you do not include the years that the Camaro did not even try to compete. And these stats came from Car and Driver. And as far as ability to make HP, that is extremely subjective. Every engine has its advantages. That a NA 5.0L can match the power of a 6.2L is a very powerful argument for Ford's engines. And do not forget that 5.8L Ford engines are capable of over 1000 HP.
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Old 05-25-2015, 08:07 AM   #139
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^Talking about for performance enthusiasts. Mustang will almost 100% outsell Chevy/Dodge combined by a ****ton if we are talking about sales. The SN95 did too but if you were a performance enthusiast who didn't have any loyalty to one brand or another it wasn't even close that you'd want a F body. Hell, the LS1 F body is STILL competitive to what is coming out in 2015 if we are talking pure performance.
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Old 05-25-2015, 10:56 AM   #140
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Sadly fbodies typically come with a white wife beater and a mullet
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10-14 before and after pics after mods gtstyles2 Mustang Paint, Appearance & Detailing 16 08-27-2013 03:45 PM
On off switch next to my hood release? Pola25 2005-2010 Mustang GT 10 12-27-2011 02:35 PM
Truck will be forsale next spring. What to get next? sonic04edge The Bar 28 09-26-2006 08:45 PM
Communist editor shot after release!!!!! Danger Dude The Bar 3 03-05-2005 04:37 PM

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