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Old 11-23-2015, 06:31 AM   #106
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The new Car and Driver has THE test on its cover -- GT vs SS.

Rodder, Electrical gremlins as stated above is about the best way to put it. I also abandoned GM for Ford based off the reliability issues I've had with GM and others like my parents and friends. I feel they owe me from my 09 Silverado Debacle and because of that they will get no more of my money. I'm not a Ford Fanboy I'm a GM "refugee" here! I should add this I still find myself rooting for Hendrick Motorsports and I would consider racing a Chevy with a Ford truck to pull it home!


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Old 11-23-2015, 08:16 AM   #107
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The new Car and Driver has THE test on its cover -- GT vs SS.

^ lemon cars.


Pick your poison.
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Old 11-23-2015, 10:10 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by The Panther View Post
Okay, C&D gave the Camaro the nod and it looks like a real nice car. GM makes some nice products, no doubt. But, for me personally, (and I'm not putting anyone else down if they do otherwise), anything after model year 2009, GM won't get a penny of my money. Everyone on this board and those who aren't, were forced to bail GM out some years back, and they STILL didn't pay the remainder of what they owe back. Their excuse to the government is "oh well, you invested in a company, you take a risk of losing money". Uh, . . this is TAXPAYER MONEY, if it wasn't for the taxpayers, GM wouldn't exist. EVERY taxpayer should be able to walk into a GM dealership and get a $5,000 discount on any vehicle they want, just as a "thank you" for bailing their a**es out. Look, it's none of my business what anybody buys, the Camaro, the GMC trucks and the Cadillac's are fine looking vehicles, but where's the rest of the taxpayer funded bailout money?
You might want to get rid of your Ford too.

Ford took $21.8 billion ($15.9 Billion for Ford Credit and $5.9 Billion under the TALF) for it's bailout and begged for more. If they hadn't have sold off Aston Martin, Land Rover, Volvo, Jaguar and Mazda when they did, they would have been worse off than any of the auto manufactures.

That also doesn't include President Reagan in the 80's changing the rules for recalls so that Ford wouldn't fail because of the 200+ deaths causes by their failed transmissions.

Do research before you believe what they tell you.

The only difference is Ford's loans were not part of the TARP (Troubled Asset Relief Program) but instead were part of the TALF (Term Asset-Backed Securities Loan Facility),

Forbes Welcome

https://www.cars.com/articles/2010/1...ral-funds-too/

https://asavagefactory.wordpress.com...ut-in-history/
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Old 11-23-2015, 10:25 AM   #109
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Okay, C&D gave the Camaro the nod and it looks like a real nice car. GM makes some nice products, no doubt. But, for me personally, (and I'm not putting anyone else down if they do otherwise), anything after model year 2009, GM won't get a penny of my money. Everyone on this board and those who aren't, were forced to bail GM out some years back, and they STILL didn't pay the remainder of what they owe back. Their excuse to the government is "oh well, you invested in a company, you take a risk of losing money". Uh, . . this is TAXPAYER MONEY, if it wasn't for the taxpayers, GM wouldn't exist. EVERY taxpayer should be able to walk into a GM dealership and get a $5,000 discount on any vehicle they want, just as a "thank you" for bailing their a**es out. Look, it's none of my business what anybody buys, the Camaro, the GMC trucks and the Cadillac's are fine looking vehicles, but where's the rest of the taxpayer funded bailout money?
I agree with you totally and at the time I was willing to let GM and Chrysler slide down the tubes if they couldn't pull themselves out of the slump...and although GM did pay back the initial loan with TARP money that had been sitting in escrow that still left the US Government with 61% of the stock.....when the Government sold it they lost about $9 billion. That means every taxpayer....who actually paid their taxes in the US was out about $100....when I signed the order for the Cadillac I got over 30 times that off sticker plus I'll be getting a $700 debit card for Costco from GM.....
Just one last thing.....since when do taxpayers tell the Government how to spend the money we donate to them.....so when you say "WE" were forced to bail out GM...it wasn't our money.....it's the Governments money and they spend how ever they darn well like........if you don't like it stop paying taxes, setup an offshore account, get a good tax consultant.......just stop crying about how the government is spending your money..........
This thread has gone from Camaro vs Mustang to politics and I apologize for helping it get off track....J'ai fini
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Old 11-23-2015, 10:49 AM   #110
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Rodder, Electrical gremlins as stated above is about the best way to put it. I also abandoned GM for Ford based off the reliability issues I've had with GM and others like my parents and friends. I feel they owe me from my 09 Silverado Debacle and because of that they will get no more of my money. I'm not a Ford Fanboy I'm a GM "refugee" here! I should add this I still find myself rooting for Hendrick Motorsports and I would consider racing a Chevy with a Ford truck to pull it home!


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I appreciate your candor and will certainly keep that in mind if and when I have issues....unfortunately I've fallen for the car.
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Old 11-23-2015, 04:40 PM   #111
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The new Car and Driver has THE test on its cover -- GT vs SS.

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I appreciate your candor and will certainly keep that in mind if and when I have issues....unfortunately I've fallen for the car.

There is no doubt it's a very nice car. I would rather be wrong than wish on you the problems I had with GM over the last few years to prove a point. So good luck with your new car. A guy at work has one and it's fast and nice! So don't feed it after midnight, keep it dry, and I wish you well!


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Old 11-23-2015, 04:54 PM   #112
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I would rather my tax dollars bail out GM than alot of other things they spend my money on to me that's a non issue. I also believe that the money Ford Credit was given was to offset defaulted auto loans and prevent them for going after citizens hurt by the economy.


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Old 11-23-2015, 06:17 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by dave73 View Post
There is no doubt it's a very nice car. I would rather be wrong than wish on you the problems I had with GM over the last few years to prove a point. So good luck with your new car. A guy at work has one and it's fast and nice! So don't feed it after midnight, keep it dry, and I wish you well!


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Thanks, I'm clearing a spot in the garage as we speak and although it won't be a garage queen like the 03 Cobra, it will live inside when not driven....I never feed any of my vehicles after midnight.........watch that movie many, many times.
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