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Old 09-14-2017, 10:35 AM   #1
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A much better GT is just sitting on the shelf at Ford.

Dear Ford,
You have an engine that is ready, willing and waiting to be put in the Mustang GT, the Raptor's 3.5 liter dual turbo V6. At 450 HP and 510 (!!) lb/ft of torque, it would embarrass even the new 2018 Mustang's 5.0. The new Raptor is faster than the old 6.2 liter V8 (!!) by a LOT -- and lighter and better handling as well.
Ford, you were willing to risk making this engine the top of the line in your money-making F150 line over the previously offered V8's. And now 75% of all new F150's sold (and 100% of your king of the hill Raptors) are EcoBoost V6's. Heck, even your $450,000 Ford GT has this engine....but I am not even asking for the 600 HP version that one has.....OK, that would be cool in the Shelby.....
PLEASE put this engine in the Mustang. We NEED this engine in the Mustang......and again -- this Mustang would be lighter (much less weight over the front wheels), better handling, better MPG (when we are able to stay out of the BOOST!) and:

510 lb/ft of TORQUE!!!!

Please?
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Old 09-14-2017, 11:24 AM   #2
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It'd be nasty for sure with that 10 speed behind it. I'd take one with a Tremec manual behind it though.


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Old 09-14-2017, 12:09 PM   #3
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IDK, I'm not really into the sound. For me, that is at the top of the list for a Mustang. It would surely be a cool setup. I'm not really the target buyer anyway, so lol.
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Old 09-14-2017, 12:26 PM   #4
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I do not want a Mustang, or a truck with a V6.
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Old 09-14-2017, 01:25 PM   #5
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I do not want a Mustang, or a truck with a V6.
I'll admit that I ALWAYS put the top down in the garage before I start the car so that I can hear the 5.0 light off......and put it in second gear in a couple of tunnels in town and do a full throttle blast just to hear it....................however -- think of this:
The 5.0's torque peak is WAY up there at 4,700 rpm. It is and always has been a high winding engine to get the most out of it.
Now, think about 510 lb/ft of torque ALL AVAILABLE AT ONLY 2,100 RPM.....

I too love the 5.0, but I have also driven the 3.5 EcoBoost many miles in my old F-150, and it is a FUN engine, with a character completely different (and LOTS faster) than the 5.0. And in a truck, take my word for it, it is a towing monster. I passed every V8 on every hill towing a nearly 9,000 pound travel trailer.
When those turbos spool up and the torque peak hits at 2,100 rpm, the thing just pulls you toward the horizon in a way that waiting for the 5.0 torque just does NOT do.
I really think that one drive in a Raptor engined Mustang GT would be a real convincer to many (OK maybe not all) 5.0 devotees.
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Old 09-14-2017, 02:33 PM   #6
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I have been dealing with boosted cars for years, and that 3.5 EB will rape the 5.0 sideways. I know the v6 makes power, and i know it is faster, and i know it will always be faster, but i'm kind of with the whole "sound" argument.
I dont think i'd be upset if they put it in there, i dont think a mustang only needs a v8 (especially after whooping up on 2vs and 3vs in my wife's 3.7 ...) but i do love that high revving 5.0 wail.
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Old 09-14-2017, 02:55 PM   #7
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I do not want a Mustang, or a truck with a V6.
I second....
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Old 09-14-2017, 06:07 PM   #8
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I do not want a Mustang, or a truck with a V6.
Till you drive one...
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Old 09-14-2017, 06:36 PM   #9
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Till you drive one...
^^^ This...........and thanks for weighing in!!
I know what the 3.5 Eco did to 5.0 sales in the F-150, and there is a reason for that. Ford makes a Max Tow option with big mirrors and heavier underpinnings --- they don't offer that in the 5.0, only in the 3.5 Eco, which is now rated to tow an UNREAL 12,200 pounds. The 5.0's torque peak is just too high to tow well.
I loved flooring my F-150 when the light turned green. It would roll out about 18 feet while spooling the turbos, and then WHAM, it would start to haze the rear tires all the rest of the way through 1st gear, and the first 20 feet of 2nd gear.....in a 5,800 pound 4 X 4 TRUCK! And, this was the old, lesser Eco, not the new higher performance one.
I simply cannot imagine what the Raptor engine would be like in the Mustang.....other that it would quite simply kick @$$....manual or 10 speed auto --- it would be enough of a thrill, I would happily give up the 5.0 sound. You could not wipe the grin off my face in 1st through 3rd gears. It would have to be a low 3 second 0 to 60 car......and with a tune?
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Old 09-14-2017, 06:42 PM   #10
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I second....
I do understand, I really do......BUT.....510 lb/ft of torque virtually right off the line!!!!!
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Old 09-14-2017, 06:58 PM   #11
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Hemi. ...and if that doesn't do the job a twin turbo Cummins between the fenders of a Ram will snap your neck.
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Old 09-14-2017, 07:16 PM   #12
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The old school guys will only want a v8 but there is a lot of appeal to the 3.5 in the mustang with the 10spd auto behind it. Add in a tune from a company like livernois (+70hp/90tq@peak) you'll have one bad *** mustang without anymore than a tune.
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Old 09-14-2017, 09:33 PM   #13
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Hemi. ...and if that doesn't do the job a twin turbo Cummins between the fenders of a Ram will snap your neck.
Cummins is a six cylinder.
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Old 09-14-2017, 09:53 PM   #14
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Cummins is a six cylinder.
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Old 09-15-2017, 06:59 AM   #15
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Cummins is a six cylinder.
Also a diesel. It's an entirely different animal.
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Old 09-15-2017, 07:00 AM   #16
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I'm laughing with ya. I was caught on a small technicality. Lol
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Old 09-15-2017, 12:06 PM   #17
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Its only a matter of time IMO. There will probably be optional 5.0 for the first few years and you'll get some asking "oh did you get a free purse with that V6?" and then they'll line up and get gapped like crazy by the 6.

Better power, better mileage, better drivability etc... sign me up. 6 cyls don't sound terrible and the turbos make up for it anyway.
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Old 09-15-2017, 01:31 PM   #18
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only if ford can charge same price as raptor. As far as I know, no one can buy a raptor without paying MSRP. Actually, many raptor owners pay more than MSRP for their ride.
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Old 09-15-2017, 05:43 PM   #19
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Also a diesel. It's an entirely different animal.
I wonder if the Powerstroke and Duramax owners make fun of the Cummins owners, calling them "litttle sixers", and making jokes about 25% of their engine being missng?

I would hate to see the V8 Mustangs go extinct, as well. And trucks.
It just wouldn't seem right.
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Old 09-15-2017, 05:53 PM   #20
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^ what about the 4 banger Duramax's?


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Old 09-15-2017, 05:53 PM   #21
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Its only a matter of time IMO. There will probably be optional 5.0 for the first few years and you'll get some asking "oh did you get a free purse with that V6?" and then they'll line up and get gapped like crazy by the 6.

Better power, better mileage, better drivability etc... sign me up. 6 cyls don't sound terrible and the turbos make up for it anyway.
I agree. Ford will likely make both available so as not to offend the "hardcore" Mustang aficionados.
I guess that they will have to drop the V8 completely, at some point, to be able to comply with future CAFE standards.
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Old 09-15-2017, 05:56 PM   #22
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^ what about the 4 banger Duramax's?


Pick your poison.
I actually don't keep up with diesel technology much.
What vehicles are those engines used in?
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Old 09-15-2017, 06:12 PM   #23
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A much better GT is just sitting on the shelf at Ford.

Small trucks. Canyon and Colorado. I find it funny that the new "small trucks" are almost the size of my 00 Silverado.
Cummins also has a 4 banger. If its used in any Chrysler vehicles I don't know.


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Old 09-15-2017, 06:20 PM   #24
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I knew Cummins had a 4cyl but didn't realize that GM had a little Duramax. That's interesting.
It makes sense, I suppose, that the manufacturers start putting small diesel engines in their mid-sized trucks.
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Old 09-15-2017, 07:02 PM   #25
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Time for a little powerstroke.


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Old 09-15-2017, 07:04 PM   #26
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only if ford can charge same price as raptor. As far as I know, no one can buy a raptor without paying MSRP. Actually, many raptor owners pay more than MSRP for their ride.
I disagree......there is much more modification done to the Raptor (and, it is somewhat limited edition) over the standard bodied F-150 to justify the bigger price increase. The wider body, the Fox reservoir shocks etc.....none of which would have to be done to the Mustang to drop the 3.5 Eco into it.
As a matter of fact. I think it is possible that there could be a price decrease -- unlikely, I know....Ford now has many years experience manufacturing the 3.5, and has it down to a science.
You doubters need to go drive one......the 3.5 Eco in all its derivations is a monster of an engine, with an immediate, immense and flat torque curve all the way to redline......no waiting for a 4,700 rpm torque arrival.
It would transform the Mustang, and embarrass the special editions of all Camaro's.
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Old 09-15-2017, 11:55 PM   #27
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Very interesting thread.
I've been driving my 3.6l twin turbo for almost a year now and although now on the second motor I can say it's a real pleasure to drive. It handles as good as my old 14 TrakPak did and could and has shown it's tail lights to a few cars. The ride is incredible and having 4 doors and actual room for 4 people is really nice and 464hp @ 5800 and 445lbft @ 3500 is great...with that said I bought my first 1965 Mustang convertible in 1972 and have had a number of them...although never with a six cylinder...kind of like in my younger days you'd never be caught with 2 two many doors. Now that I'm older than 90% of the people on this forum I can say a V6 that makes that kind of power...as long as it is reliable...is just fine with me. The sound really doesn't bother me as my 3.6l doesn't sound like your normal 6 and even my Mini with aftermarket exhaust sounds great, not too loud but not like a Honda with some soup can on the exhaust tip.
Personally I think the Raptor is overpriced for what it is and what I bought a pickup for was to haul stuff and pull a big trailer so why would anyone settle for 500lbft of torque when you can buy a 6 cylinder Cummings with over 800lbft of torque and 660lbft of torque at 1500rpm. If you want a toy truck to run around in I guess that's great if you've got $60k+. So, in the real world this is what a Raptor can do:

2017 FORD RAPTOR SUPER CAB

Maximum payload weight: 1,000 lbs

Maximum trailer weight: 6,000 lbs (with a weight distributing hitch, see table below).

GCWR: 12,000 lbs

2017 FORD RAPTOR SUPER CREW CAB

Maximum payload weight: 1,200 lbs

Maximum trailer weight: 8,000 lbs (with a weight distributing hitch, see table below).

GCWR: 14,250 lbs

What does this mean in the real world? If you have a 2017 Raptor Super Crew, and you are towing an 8,000 lbs trailer (with 800 lbs of tongue weight), then you can add up to 400 lbs of weight (people and/or cargo). All together, truck + trailer + people + cargo cannot exceed the GCWR, which is 14,250 lbs for the Raptor crew cab.
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Old 09-16-2017, 08:25 AM   #28
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I want a 3 cyl diesel in my next Stang.

side note: on Holiday last two weeks and had a VW Tiguan 4 cyl Turbo for a rental. It will do Autobahn (sp?) speeds at 8000 feet of elevation. Nice smaller SUV but I'm not a fan of German part/service prices.
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Old 09-16-2017, 07:30 PM   #29
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I'd actually prefer the 2.7 eco, less mass over the nose and quicker response. You give me RWD, 350 hp and 3400 lbs and i'm going to be one happy camper.
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Old 09-16-2017, 09:32 PM   #30
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I want a 3 cyl diesel in my next Stang.

side note: on Holiday last two weeks and had a VW Tiguan 4 cyl Turbo for a rental. It will do Autobahn (sp?) speeds at 8000 feet of elevation. Nice smaller SUV but I'm not a fan of German part/service prices.
Why there are like 9,000 real cheap BMWs on CL every day lol. Can pick up like a 2007 7 series that looks near new for $4k but you KNOW there is a ****ton of required maintenance due on it.
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Old 09-16-2017, 09:37 PM   #31
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I would be totally down for a hybrid Mustang. Keep the V8, but add some electric power to it. That would be a nice combination.
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Old 09-16-2017, 09:49 PM   #32
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The all electric Tesla sports cars are actually SCARY fast. Instant torque, no AF ratios, no fuel system. Just floor it and boom.
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Old 09-16-2017, 09:55 PM   #33
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Tire manufacturers are gonna need to step up their game if the power levels keep going in the direction they are going lol.
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Old 09-16-2017, 11:35 PM   #34
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Why there are like 9,000 real cheap BMWs on CL every day lol. Can pick up like a 2007 7 series that looks near new for $4k but you KNOW there is a ****ton of required maintenance due on it.
I wonder if American automobiles are heading in the same direction?
They are beginning to use much of the same technology that makes the European luxury cars so expensive to maintain.

Will the new American vehicles require so much expensive maintenance that they will only be worth 10-20% of their original purchase price after 7-8 years?
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Old 09-16-2017, 11:42 PM   #35
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Very interesting thread.
I've been driving my 3.6l twin turbo for almost a year now and although now on the second motor I can say it's a real pleasure to drive. .
What happened to the engine?
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