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Old 05-25-2007, 09:58 AM   #71
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

"In areas of recent volcanism the plants capture volcanic carbon dioxide, devoid of C14 as well as atmospheric CO2. As a result there is a decrease in radiocarbon concentration in recent wood. The apparent radiocarbon age of such recent wood comes sometimes to 6000 years. A change in C14 concentration of dendrochronologically associated samples gives an outline of the changes in the activity of the nearby volcanoes."

This also goes back to what I was saying about large amounts of CO2 suddenly being created can affect the ratio. There are "suddenly" more unaffected Carbon atoms that haven't been bombarded with the sun's radiation. Heck, even forest fires could cause a small impact. Less plants to "inhale" CO2, and "exhale" O. In addition to what the burning fire itself might have done.
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Old 05-25-2007, 10:45 AM   #72
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

I've lost sight of what we're debating...Why are you trying to come up examples of how C-14 dating didn't work, again?
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Old 05-25-2007, 10:49 AM   #73
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

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Okay, fine. The world is only 10,000 years old, the way the universe works changes regularly, and there was a big boat with two of every dinosaur on it.
Recently very old cave drawings were found of Noah leading the dinosaurs onto the boat. The tons and tons of food that would be required didnt matter either since they were floating on water and dinosaurs cant starve if floating on top of water.
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Old 05-25-2007, 11:07 AM   #74
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

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I've lost sight of what we're debating...Why are you trying to come up examples of how C-14 dating didn't work, again?
Look Mark, even OJ came up with enough reasonable doubt to get away with murder. If they can convince you that there is a .000000000001% chance that the glove didnt fi...i mean that C-14 dating might not be completely 100% accurate in all scenarios, even given the fact that things like vocanic eruptions would also be recorded in the geology and would be accounted for, well, you have no choice but to admit that science is all a sham used by the freemason's to keep you in line and that God is the only way anything could have happened. He used his magic, its the only logical explanation.
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Old 05-25-2007, 11:26 AM   #75
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

We all need to simply go and read Woot For Road Trips. It holds all answers to everything.
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Old 05-25-2007, 11:33 AM   #76
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

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We all need to simply go and read Woot For Road Trips. It holds all answers to everything.
!!!! The voice of logic
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Old 05-25-2007, 03:20 PM   #77
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

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So....we can know with 100% certainty that millions of years ago, all creatures had a definable amount of c-14 in their bodies? This is all based on science that is only a 100-200 years old?

The point is, how can anyone be confident that the amount of c-14 in living tissue/non-living strata/etc is at the same levels it is today? You can't. You can't say that dinosaurs had X amount of C-14 in their bodies when they died. No one can define that without a delorian and some measuring equipment.
I think this is the third time I've said it... carbon-14 dating only works to 50,000 years... they DON'T use it on dinosaurs. Plus, Uranium dating is what they use to determine age of earth (pretty sure anyway)... and that isn't something that "magically changes" with a bad wind. carbon-14 dating only really works for "recent fossils", which aren't even fossilized.
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Old 05-25-2007, 03:24 PM   #78
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

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I think this is the third time I've said it... carbon-14 dating only works to 50,000 years... they DON'T use it on dinosaurs. Plus, Uranium dating is what they use to determine age of earth (pretty sure anyway)... and that isn't something that "magically changes" with a bad wind. carbon-14 dating only really works for "recent fossils", which aren't even fossilized.
You will have to find those posts...cause I can't. :box:

So then....how do we know the level of uranium from when the earth was created in order to determine how much has decayed? :box: again.
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Old 05-25-2007, 03:32 PM   #79
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

"Uranium-uranium dating is a radiometric dating technique utilizing the comparison of two isotopes of uranium (U) in a sample: 238U and 234U. 234U/238U dating is one of several radiometric dating techniques exploiting the uranium radioactive decay series, in which 238U undergoes 14 alpha and beta decay events while decaying to the stable isotope 206Pb. Other dating techniques using this decay series include uranium-thorium (using 230Th/238U) and uranium-lead dating.

238U, with a half-life of about 4.5 billion years, decays to 234U through emission of an alpha particle to an isotope of thorium (234Th), which is comparatively unstable with a half-life of just 24 days. 234Th then decays through beta particle emission to an isotope of protactinium, 234Pa. 234Pa decays with a half-life of 6.7 hours, again through emission of a beta particle, to 234U. This isotope has a half-life of about 245,000 years. The next decay product, 230Th, has a half-life of about 75,000 years and is used for the related 230Th/238U technique. Although analytically simpler than 230Th/238U dating, in practice 234U/238U dating is almost never used as unlike 230Th/238U dating it requires prior knowldege of the 234U/238U ratio at the time the material under study was formed. For those materials (principally marine carbonates) for which the initial ratio is known, 230Th/238U remains a superior technique. This restricts the application of 234U/238U to extremely rare cases where the initial 234U/238U is well-constrained and the sample is also beyond the ca. 450,000 year upper limit of the 230Th/238U technique.

Unlike other radiometric dating techniques, those using the uranium decay series (except for those using the stable final isotopes 206Pb and 207Pb) compare the ratios of two radioactive unstable isotopes. This complicates calculations as both the parent and daughter isotopes decay over time into other isotopes.

In theory, the 234U/238U technique can be useful in dating samples between about 10,000 and 2 million years Before Present (BP), or up to about eight times the half-life of 234U. As such, it provides a useful bridge in radiometric dating techniques between the ranges of 230Th/238U (accurate up to ca. 450,000 years) and U-Pb dating (accurate up to the age of the solar system, but problematic on samples younger than about 2 million years)." - Uranium-uranium dating: Information from Answers.com

so basically, if you have a sample of uranium, it will have decays occurring. 14 total steps to ultimately yield Pb-206. By taking the ratios of unstable atoms... you can figure out the initial concentrations. Especially since if you have a sample of uranium, lead will only be present if decay has occurred... and the half life of U-238 is 4.5 billion years. That's a LONG time... much much longer than 10,000 years.
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Old 05-25-2007, 03:40 PM   #80
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)



Oh well....guess I need to stop trying to get people to ask "how can you be so sure" about science...it is all there in black and white...written by scientists how their scientific formulas work to validate their scientific findings.

Here's a funny though...how do they know it takes 4.5 billion years for uraniums half life? No one has been around long enough with a sample to say "It took 4.5 billion years for this biatch to decay"...must be more of those scientific forumlas again.
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Old 05-25-2007, 03:46 PM   #81
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

you don't need to wait for half of it to decay. Remember, all you care is that it decays exponentially. If you know your sample size, you can determine how fast it is decaying, set that as T=0, come back, and measure it in a year, and there's T=1... you can compare the difference in the number of atoms decaying based on those measurements (and of course they do this for MANY years), and plot them, and it starts the curve. From there, you can find the half life. Because half life is dependent upon the amount of sample present, not a set size. It's really simple, and since I have to get ready, I don't have time to get into it. But maybe later after work I will.
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Old 05-25-2007, 03:51 PM   #82
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

here you go, this should help explain a little better:
Exponential decay - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Radioactive decay - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Radiometric dating - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Potassium-argon dating - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Radiocarbon dating - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

in case you were curious about the efforts being made.
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Old 05-25-2007, 05:24 PM   #83
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

At some point you have to just accept that if 99.9% of the evidence points in one direction, that last .1% probably will too. No, you'll never be "sure" but you'd still be a fool to just ignore the other 99.9%.
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Old 05-28-2007, 01:34 PM   #84
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Re: uh... (weird news article about dinosaurs and noah)

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Attacking Religions and attacking a god are different things. Just because someone attacks Christians beliefs and ways of understanding the universe does not mean they do not belief that there is a god somewhere out there.

I just wanted to make it clear that just because someone disagrees with a Religion does not mean they automatically disregard a higher power.

Noted and marked
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