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Windows 10 official release/rollout is here

39K views 475 replies 20 participants last post by  scottydsntknow 
#1 ·
Will for damn sure be upgrading tomorrow. Fresh wipe and install Win10 Pro from the .iso I burnt tonight from the Microsoft website. Totally free for those who did not know. I recommend doing a clean wipe/install whenever doing a system upgrade and the Win10 Pro gets you bitlocker along with a few other worthwhile things.

I only went to Win8.1 myself for performance over 7 when gaming. 7 is still on my laptop and we still use it at work. I will be putting EVERYTHING on 10 though. Higher performance, and the biggie is DirectX 12 support which even 8.1 will not have.

Also going from 16 to 32 gigs of RAM on the gaming PC and going to try pull the case apart and clean everything out and then see how good the auto overclock feature on my newish motherboard is. Been running all 6 cores at 3.5ghz (up from 2.8ghz) on the auto feature for a few months now. Going to kick it up to 4.0ghz x6 and see what happens.
 
#255 ·
Zen looks amazing but I'll wait for enough ppl to be testers on it before I jump. My FX processor still does just fine for what I do.
 
#258 · (Edited)
Yeah but are you gaming at a really high pixel count or just a regular 1920x1080 monitor? It takes very little in the way of GPU to max out a 1080p display these days. I probably should have got a single 1070 for what I'm doing but I'm an AMD nutcase and spent roughly what it would cost on a single 1070 for dual air cooled Furies. Anyone who got in on the $230 per Fury card deal is in the same boat. I will say when multi GPU is properly enabled by the game this system will run anything ANYTHING I throw at it at 3440x1440 but problem is a lot of stuff is sketch on it. Good thing is the Radeon control center makes it easy to manage all the CF settings.

Anyway... 1080p you are more than fine with a Nvidia 1060 or a AMD RX480 or a Fury or even the Nvidia 1050ti. That thing is $120 for certain brands and is great for a single 1080p monitor.

That said, now you don't have to worry about when you upgrade monitors (if you need to). My recommendation is to wait for a special on a real nice 100+hz 27" 1440p with G-Sync (Nvidia's proprietary adaptive sync) or... if you want to become part of the UltraWide Master Race then budget $800-$1200 for a real nice curved 3440x1440 at 34" monitor.

Same. Ready to see the difference from my 690 ������

Sent from my LGLS990 using Mustang Evolution mobile app
If you are gaming on 1080p, just be aware that you don't need a TON of card, especially single monitor. I had a set of $40 cards in a crossfire that were still maxing out a single 1080p monitor middle of last year. If you are on a single 1080p TV I'd say grab a $120 1050ti and roll. That thing is a game changer for ppl at 1080p single monitor/TV.
 
#261 ·
Don't do 2 for gaming, either get 3 or an ultrawide or a single really nice 1440p 27" monitor for your main viewing and throw 2 cheaper 1080s on each side.
 
#264 ·
Yeah its a monster for sure, glad its working well. Now you ARE supporting a card that big with some kind of bracing right?
 
#267 ·
Finally getting the wife into gaming... FINALLY. Not like... crazy hardcore gaming and she does not like hyper violent games but Undertale, Ori and the Blind Forest, Civ V and a few others so far. Hilariously, doing it all on an old dual core 3.4ghz Phenom II and a Powercolor HD7850. Which is still a ridiculous card for what it can do for the prices you can get them at now at 1080p. I was using 2 of them in a crossfire up until last year and was playing everything at 1080p just fine.
 
#269 ·
Lol I'm raising one. My little girl is almost 8 and she's super into gaming. And sports too, she plays Ice Hockey and Soccer. Can do both. Wife is all happy with Undertale.
 
#270 · (Edited by Moderator)
I mean REAL hardcore.
The ones who don't do anything EXCEPT game!

I have seen enough horror stories in school with lazy girl gamers. they grow to be lazy women, & you don't want that.
I used to play soccer & dirt bike & i wrestled since i was 5, & ringette of course ??
but... of course, the new Nintendo Switch is coming in a few months...
... & i just bought a NES Mini 2 months ago, so i'm not one to talk haha
Autocorrect is my worst enema...
 
#271 ·
Lol nice. Same issue with guys. We had a guy at work who was unable to pass physical fitness and was always late because of a video game addiction.

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Mustang Evolution mobile app
 
#272 ·
Lol nice. Same issue with guys. We had a guy at work who was unable to pass physical fitness and was always late because of a video game addiction.

Well, more boys are hardcore gamers than girls,
but boys at all the high schools here were complaining that their girlfriends wouldn't even look at them,
& they wouldn't get dressed,
or bathe, even
the boys were cryin'...



Autocorrect is my worst enema...
 
#273 ·
There are plenty of hardcore gamer girls now but yes... Still more guys although the gap is closing fast. No matter what the MRAs say lol.

Truth about a lot of gamer guys tho. Have this self worth complex that is completely out of line with how they treat ppl, look and act.

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Mustang Evolution mobile app
 
#275 ·
So bringing this thread back... wondering if I should use this upcoming Black Friday right before I (hopefully) move overseas to grab a 3.6 Ryzen. Yes I know its still a ways off but prices have come down a bit and probably will have screaming deals.


2 reasons... 1 would be to swap the 8350 into my daughter's computer and 2 would be basically just because. Still use my computer mostly for gaming.


Seems the upgrade would be in the $400 range with a CPU, mobo and 16 gigs of DDR4. Not sure if worth it right now. Have clocked the FX back to stock 4.0ghz speeds as I really didn't see any gaming difference at 4.8ghz but might crank it back up again and re-check that.
 
#276 ·
Having done several Ryzen 6 and 8 core builds, even at stock speeds vs a 5 Ghz FX, Ryzen will wipe the floor with it. In my testing, Ryzen has been around twice as fast clock for clock and core for core than FX in benchmarks and generally at least 40% faster in CPU limited games.

The FX CPU's (63xx and 83xx) have aged much better than Intel's Sandy and Ivy chips from the same time. That being said, if I were still on either chip of those chips, I would be looking to upgrade in the near future. Since you are going to be relocating to Europe, I would suggest grabbing something stateside before making the trip as hardware costs over there are generally a good bit higher than they are here.

Also, with Ryzen, remember you aren't just upgrading to a faster CPU, you are getting a MUCH better platform (PCIE 3.0, better sata 6, m2, etc..) along with upgrade options when Ryzen 2 hits sometime next year.

If you do go with Ryzen, grab the 1600 or 1700 as they all overclock to around 4.0 Ghz. Either of the 6 or 8 cores should be a good bit faster than than your FX. Also, if going Ryzen, I would suggest the Asrock X370 Taichi and X370 Fata1ty Gaming Professional or the Asus X370 Strix or Crosshair VI Hero along with fast DDR4 (DDR4 3200) with good timings.
 
#277 ·
Well looks like I know what I'm doing this fall lol. My kid will be happy getting my 8350 from an old 6 core Phenom II.

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Mustang Evolution mobile app
 
#278 · (Edited)
Hey ISH so you are saying the cheap Ryzen 1600 (non X) will do just fine, clock it to 4.0ghz and roll? Worth it to spend the $60 or so more for the 8 core 1700?

Edit: Dayum bare bones $214 for the 6 core, $189 for the mobo and $125 for some Ripjaws 16gb DDR4 3200... little bit much money but I'll have to see what BF looks like this year.

I will be able to get the stuff in Spain, I'll have a US PO Box, I was able to buy a laptop and nice gaming mouse while I was deployed in the middle east a few years back lol.
 
#279 ·
All Ryzen CPUs regardless of core count seem to top out around 4.0 Ghz. So yes, go with the cheapest 6 or 8 core and OC it.

As for the 6 or 8 core ... beside epeen in 3dmark scores, going from my 5820K @ 4.7 Ghz (6 core 12 thread) to 6950x @ 4.4 Ghz (10 core 20 thread) had basically no real world gains in my normal day to day activities. In fact, most games and other things were faster on the 5820K than the 6950x.

It seems that currently 6 core / 12 thread is the sweet spot for most applications. Then again, Intel is coming out with consumer class 6 core / 12 thread I7's with Coffee Lake the last quarter of this year. Then you have AMD preparing to really lay the smack-down on Intel with Threadripper and it's 16 core / 32 threads for less than $1k and Intel has an 18 core /36 thread HEDT (high end desktop) CPU that is also coming out the end of this year. So the core wars have started now that AMD is back in the game. Which means that in a year or two the software should be able to take advantage of the hardware.

FWIW, I plan on going with AMD threadripper and it's 16 core / 32 threads whenever they become available and dumping my X99 system.
 
#280 ·
Ok awesome. I am done with e-peen scores... I dunno why ppl build some of the systems they build with no real world applications other than benchmarking... I guess kinda like the 40-something Vette and GT500 crowd at cars and coffee comparing dyno sheets with cars with stock suspension and tires.

I'll probably grab the 1600 non X, a good mobo and some good ram. The Sabertooh and 8350 will go in the Steam Machine/Server and my kid will get the FX6300 that's in there now.

Thanks again, you are a wealth of knowledge.
 
#281 ·
And now the wife wants a new laptop before we go too... mainly because when we do go we'll be desktop-less ffor a month or so and both need a computer. My daughter has a new galaxy tablet so she is good.

She did say she wanted a surface pro but... $800 for an i3 with 4GB of ram... bleh... but maybe I'm being stupid about that? I dunno. I could probably get her a very nice Acer or HP for $300-$400 on Black Friday, all she wants is a 13-15" small laptop that can do office and the internet. Don't think I need to drop the $$$ on a Surface Pro for that...

Also probably going to go Ryzen sooner than later. I know this FX is holding me back a LOT right now. Games I should be getting much better framerates that have great Xfire support are not where I want them. Need to get rid of this bottleneck lol. Although I'm just playing BattleFleet Gothic Armada right now which is graphically not very needy although their 3440x1440 setup sucks.
 
#282 ·
You could always go to a pawn shop or craigslist and grab a last gen I7 in 13-15" and throw an ssd in it and call it done for like $200-$350.

The surface pro's are really nice and well built, but are a bit expensive for the hardware you get. I switched my local police/county/fire/ems over to the surface pro's instead of their outdated and basically junk Panasonic Toughbooks. In the year or so after the switch to surface pro's they have been absolutely solid. Another good laptop of similar specs is the Lenovo Yoga.

The biggest issue you are going to start running into with the FX is that with how different it was (cores and modules with shared resources) vs all other x86 cpu's is that it won't be getting any more optimizations from software/game developers now that Ryzen has dropped and it along with Intel's newest architecture will need specific optimizations compared to their older archs. You can see this lack of optimization by looking at benchmarks from Rise of the Tomb Raider on Ryzen before and after the Ryzen patch and also in some benchmarks of Intel's X299 CPU's being much slower than their older X99 CPU's, specifically in software that stresses the cache on the CPU's.

You should notice a pretty decent bump in performance from games that are CPU limited, especially with ones with great xfire support.
 
#283 · (Edited)
Well I found this laptop for the wife, kicking around getting it next month when I get paid or she is even ok with waiting till BF/CM really since the laptop she has now is still ok.

https://www.amazon.com/Acer-E5-575-...1501002693&sr=8-3&keywords=acer+aspire+laptop

Would bump the ram to 8gb and throw a M2 drive in it and call it. Little more $$$ with those upgrades then I want to spend tho but probably worth it for the Kaby processor and newer chipset and M2 slot.

There are also some decent laptops in the $225 range new but all on the older chipsets and slower CPUs.

With an Adata M2 drive and some used take out stick of DDR4 2400 I'm looking at about $425 for that whole thing. Little more than I wanted to spend honestly, thinking of getting her an elite book refurb with 8GB of ram for $219 but battery life is a kicker for those... She wants to be able to take it out to cafes and places when we travel in Europe.
 
#284 ·
Hey Ish question, just sold my truck and some other stuff and have a little spare $$$ to throw around.

What's your recommendation for a solid upgrade from the 8350 and possibly my crossfired R9 Furies at this moment? Wait for Black Friday sales? Not one of those ppl opposed to AMD or Intel or AMD or Nvidia. I'll grab whatever the best value for the performance at this point.

Sick of modded Skyrim struggling at 30fps on 3440x1440 tbth although I bet I'm CPU bottlenecked there although Skyrim crossfire support is garbage. Games like Witcher 3, Mordor and GTA5 look spectacular.
 
#285 ·
Skyrim is being held back by the 8350, no questions about it.

You can wait for Intel's Coffee Lake to drop on October 10. It's the first time Intel is bringing a 6 core 12 thread CPU to a mainstream platform. Intel is saying 30% higher IPC than previous generation. So, that could be worth holding off for a month on.

If not, IMO, the best overall CPU on the market is the Ryzen 5 1600. 6 cores / 12 threads, OC to 4 Ghz with DDR4 3200 or better memory and you have a solid system that will run circles around any FX CPU.

If you decide to go with Ryzen, I would suggest the Asrock X370 Taichi and X370 Fata1ty Gaming Professional or the Asus X370 Strix or Crosshair VI Hero along with fast DDR4 (DDR4 3200+) and with tight timings it will make for a hell of nice system. Also, Ryzen 2 or whatever it will be called will work on current mobos, so there will be an upgrade path.

If you want to go Intel and do it now, a good Z270 mobo and a 7700K with fast memory and a good cooler at 5+Ghz is the fastest gaming CPU you can buy, until the new CPU's arrive in October.

Only thing that sucks right now is that DDR and GPU prices are insane right now.

With the current market how it is, I would hold off getting a new GPU and just see how your Furys do in a new rig.
 
#286 · (Edited)
Yeah the ******* crypto miners are just making GPU prices crazy... I like what Microcenter is trying to do, if you order 1 card its normal price, 2 is like $20 more and then over 2 cards is like $10k per card lol. I mean it won't work but at least someone is trying to do something. Although I was able to get BOTH of my Furies last year for $450. Maybe should have got a single 1080 for another $200 but for games that do support crossfire they HAUL.

Yeah agreed on holding off on the GPU, my 2 Furies pull 60fps at 34401x1440 in Mordor in almost all locations, bogs to I think the lowest I ever saw was a blip down to 38 and mid 40s in really intense sequences when I am fighting like 80 Orcs... I'm going to assume a better CPU would jump that framerate up.

So what would YOU do? I have no issues holding off but price for value is also something. If the Ryzen 6 core will still be a better value than the new Intel I'd probably still go that route. I am working with a budget... plus the wife still wants a laptop... I could probably do the Ryzen thing for $500 or less. Nothing else needed in my rig to upgrade since the Furies are probably not holding me back.

edit: Also since I'm going to be gone from the house for training from mid october to mid november maybe I'll wait for BF/CM sales and see what I can score a Ryzen or one of those intels for... Not like another 45 days is going to kill me.
 
#287 ·
If I were in your situation, I would wait till Coffee Lake ships. If it's as good as Intel claims it is, which judging from leaked benchmarks, it's not - https://videocardz.com/72471/first-intel-core-i7-8700k-benchmarks-leaked

For reference, in Cinebench r15 - https://www.maxon.net/en/products/cinebench/, which is the first screenshot, my Haswell-E 5820K (6 core/12 thread) at 4.6 Ghz, scores 1403 in CPU and 185 in Single Core, this new 8700K, 6 core/12 thread is only 11 points faster in single core performance and it boosts to 4.7 Ghz and gets stomped by my 4 generation old Haswell-E in multi core performance. The IPC difference is likely less than a 5% increase over haswell, in the real world. Also, I believe the best I got out of that FX 8350 was I think around 840 CPU and 130 single core and that around 5.2-5.3 Ghz. Also, a recent build was a Ryzen 5 1600 @ 4.1 Ghz and it scored 1400 CPU and 171 single thread.

It's likely that AMD may cut prices or something around the release of Intel's new CPUs. Either way, you will have better information as to which would be the better buy and can make a better decision from there.

I've been looking around and sent out a few emails to my vendors and they are thinking that prices for the unlocked 6 core/12 thread 8700K will be around $400. So, if that turns out to be true, single threaded performance will be faster with Intel and overall performance should be comparable to Ryzen but at a higher cost.

One last thing, Ryzen has 24 PCIE lanes, Intel's mainstream CPU's have only had 16 for the last several years. So, if you plan on running M.2 PCIE and both GPU's, an Intel build may bottleneck.
 
#288 · (Edited)
I am planning on a NVME boot drive and keeping the 2 Furies. In that case I probably would not want to worry about a bottleneck. Still wait for Coffee to drop tho? I mean if I'm going to wait till I get back from school I might as well wait till the Black Friday fire sales they have right? And maybe Coffee will actually be that good? Is Coffee going to be limited to 16 PCIE lanes as well? That would suck for a multi card/NVME setup for sure.

I mean if Coffee still only has 16 lanes I'd go with Ryzen no brainer, just probably wait for the BF sales.

Also, I'm guessing you are a re-seller and prices are comparable to most places?
I'd rather give you business for all the free tech advice I've got from you.

edit: Oh, been running 16GB of DDR3 forever but is 8GB still serviceable for basically just gaming or should I stay at 16GB with the DDR4?

edit2: Holy crap that Taichi board is GLORIOUS... wow...
 
#289 ·
I am planning on a NVME boot drive and keeping the 2 Furies. In that case I probably would not want to worry about a bottleneck. Still wait for Coffee to drop tho? I mean if I'm going to wait till I get back from school I might as well wait till the Black Friday fire sales they have right? And maybe Coffee will actually be that good.

Or since I'm guessing you are a re-seller and prices are comparable to everyone else I'd rather give you business for all the free tech advice I've got from you.
It's really up to you on whether to wait for Coffee Lake. My thinking is that AMD might drop prices (temporarily) to take a bit of wind out of Intel's sails when they release their new lineup. Then again, they might do nothing.

I would still think that Ryzen 5 1600 @ 3.9 - 4.1 Ghz would still be the best bang for the buck CPU out there even after Coffee Lake releases. I don't see a 4 Ghz Ryzen being more than a few percent slower than a 4.7 Ghz 6 core Coffee Lake.

It's just really hard to guess where Intel will go with this. When AMD dropped Ryzen, they caught Intel with their pants down. Intel scrambled to release X299 and it was mostly a failure. Coffee Lake might actually be decent, or it could be more of the same. I just don't know and I hate to speculate.


I am a re-seller but I can't buy most major components cheaper than what you can get them from Amazon or Newegg, especially once you factor in shipping and any specials/bundles they might have.



As you can see above, I can buy Ryzen 5 1600 for $202.77 from my distributor, but I have to pay freight from Chicago unless I spend more than $1,000 and it has to be more than 10 items. If I buy 25 Ryzen 5 1600's I can get them with a single $20 rebate. If I buy 50, I can get a single $35 rebate... woo woo. Whereas you can buy Ryzen 5 1600 from Newegg for $215 but you get free shipping and a key for Quake Champions.

I can't even buy a decent GPU from any of my three distributors, everything is out of stock or WAY over priced. So I just buy them from Amazon or Newegg. Nearly all AMD cards are sold out. I can buy the an RX Vega 64 air cooled for $664. That same card on Newegg is $679 but you get two free games (Wolfenstein II and Prey) which makes that a much better deal than what I can get.

I mainly use my distributors as inside sources or use them to put me in contact with someone at a specific company (Intel, AMD, Nvidia, Asus, EVGA, Gigabyte, etc.) or if I am doing like 10+ identical builds for a business.

Profit margins on PC parts are horrible. The service side of computers is where you make money.

I appreciate the offer of giving me business however, it's just not really worth it for either one of us.
 
#290 ·
Ok cool well I tried lol. I'll probably go with Zen then... That 1600 CPU is $20 off on Tiger right now for a $199 with no shipping or tax and that Taichi is $183 after $20 mail in rebate and free shipping at Newegg. Now might be a good time to buy with $40 off the CPU/Mobo combo... Hard to be patient with the stuttering I'm getting in some games that are CPU limited.

Any advice on RAM and how much to get?
 
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