2002 V6 - H pipe or Y pipe for dual exhaust?

[AirBrontosaurus]

WHICH IS IT?

I have been all over the net, and there are so many different opinions. About half of the people say that y-pipes are garbage, sound terrible and give no power upgrades. The other half says that h-pipes are a waste because of the even firing engine, limited output and other stuff. The third half (there are three halves in this example ) says that you only need h-pipes if you do more performance stuff, but y-pipes are still not a great idea.

I was wondering if anyone had any proveable evidence of any of these claims (ie dyno results, professional opinions, etc). I would hate to pay the extra money for an H-pipe system if it isn't worth it, but I also would hate to spend all that money on an exhaust system and have it sound like crap because i tried to save a few bucks by going with the y-pipe.

If it helps, I haven't done ANY performance upgrades to my car. It is completely stock.

My priorities are as follows:

Street Legality. I don't want to mess with that stuff. It's gotta be street legal (at least in Indiana)

Sound. Horsepower improvements or not, I want it to sound good. My definition of "Good" is a really mean, low sound at high RPMs that is still quiet enough at idle/low RPMs so as not to be obnoxious. I really liked the sound of the mustang in this thread:

http://www.mustangevolution.com/foru...ound-clip.html

Price. I would really like to stay around $400 total (I won't be installing this myself, so try to take installation fees into account)

Performance. If it goes faster/accelerates faster/ travels through time, then great. One thing i do not want to do is retard performance.

If anyone has any suggestions or comments, I would absolutely love to hear them. I have never done anything with cars before, so everything I "know" is stuff i've read online. Please, share your experiences/thoughts/suggestions, and I will try to provide you with as much information I can about my car. If I have missed anything, please ask for clarification. Thanks in advance.

[Brent]

Buy you two mufflers of your choice and take them to a muffler shop. They will run you the pipes necessary to get dual exhaust.

They will run one pipe from the left header to the back of the car and one pipe from the right header to the back of the car. These two pipes will never touch.

For a few dollars more they can take a piece of pipe and "cross" the two exhaust pipes going into the back to get you an "H Pipe"

An H Pipe is not going to get you anymore hp. Some say it sound better some say it doesnt.

You are not going to get a lot of gains in the performance area anyway with this.

Just buy the two mufflers and take them to the exhaust shop. They will get you dual exhaust for under 400 dollars including the mufflers.

[AirBrontosaurus]

Alright, thanks. Now, second question:

Which mufflers would you recommend for that kind of sound?

Also, if I just show up at the old muffler shop with some mufflers that I buy (like in a kit), they can do the rest? I want to make sure I don't drive all the way out there and find out I'm missing the reverse-thrust intake manifold bearing or whatever.

Thanks!

[WhiteStang99]

^ Yeah, they can do the rest. If they say they can't, go find another exhaust shop. VERY FEW people will agree on exhaust sounds, so you're on your own there. I believe there's a web page that allows you to listen to exhaust clips, but I'm not positive.

[I_luv_HP&trq]

like brent said. two seperate pipes going all the way back is the best thing for you.

Try out a couple different shops before you settle on one. I went around trying to find a place that looked like they needed business and told them the guy down the street would do it for less and they beat his price. make some deals.

If you're buying a kit online then that would make their job even easier. they should come with hangers (brackets needed to weld pipe to chasis) but if the kits don't then the exhaust shop for sure should have them.
take your time on finding the right set up and good luck.

[lowflyn]

Yeh, there is no need for any crossover pipe at all in your exhaust. I ran true duals with flowpath afterburners dumped at the moment. Really deep down low, loud enough to set off alarms around 1500 rpms, and still quiet at cruising.

[SpectorV]

Ok its time to go over some exhaust stuff. The stock exhaust on the 3.8L v6 has two headers that merge, after the set of cats and resonators, into a single pipe. This conversion is called the Y pipe area. Then the pipe goes to the muffler and to the tip. The pipe is 2.25 inches in diameter stock.

Most decide to simply cut the pipe before they merch and run a set of pipes from each side out to elimiate the Y pipe. Some assume they need an H pipe (aka a small pipe connecting the two sides) for exhasut pressure, the v6 is an even fire engine so it does not need to equal out anything. The H pipe doesnt do much of anything, but when I added mine to my dual exhaut it seemed to make it lower toned (not as loud) at idle.

If you add custom true dual exhaust (a shop bends it) you will not be able to remove the exhaust to work on the tranny or what not, and depending on if you have a manual or an auto and the bends made this may or may not be a problem. (My manual tranny came out with out the exhaust getting in the way. The reason is the t-5 can be removed from the bellhousing and removed first)

They make adaptor kits (steeda does as well as many other companies) that can be welded in so you maintain the ability to bolt/unbolt the cat back exhaust. If you do this you may purchase any GT 99-04 or 94-98 (which have longer polished tips that look better on the v6's rear bumper) and it will bolt up.

This way is the best all around, but does not have to be done. A good shop can weld up a 2.25 inch stainless steel cat back(make sure its stainless) and you will be good to go.

There are also bolt up Y pipe cat backs with fake dual exhaust, these work just about as good really, not much difference unless you plan on going with big motor mods and pushing alot of hp/tq. Near stock this works perfectly fine.

I would expect to pay 300-500 dollars for an exhaust system depending on what you do~

The tips you select should NOT be chrome (NOT be chrome) due to they will rust in a matter of days and slowly eat the outside and inside up and look horrible. You need to go with polished stainless steel tips (regardless of what the shop tries to tell you)

www.rodshopperformance.com is where i got my tips (2.5 inch wide by 20 inches long for 2.25 pipe) and they are still in perfect shape 2 years later.

Make sure your tips are at least 20 inches long (if at all possible) due to the nature of the v6 rear bumper, its very tacky to see where the tip is welded on, especially if your tip is much larger that your pipe diameter. The shop should ANGLE THE TIP UPWARDS. The curve of the rear bumper makes the tips look like they are pointed down even though they are even with the ground, so make SURE they angle the tips up a few degrees, not a ton mind up just a bit.

The fuel lines do NOT get in the way of dual exhaut, the GTs have the EXACT same fitment and lines. Make sure if you go custom bend pipe its mandrel bent and make SURE they leave you plenty of clearence over the top of the axle, if you ever lower the car or go over big bumps it can bottom out on the axles, and items such as panhard bars wont clear the rear axle either.

Thats about it, expect 5-7rwhp and 4-5rwtq~ for 99-04 v6s and pretty much the same for pre 99's. Its an ok mod, I would suggest mufflers that are not super loud, my flowmaster 40 series 2 chambers are the most noise I would want.

A CAI makes the exhaust a bit different in tone and maybe a bit louder.

[AirBrontosaurus]

Thanks a lot!

OK, more questions...

Since the factory cats are before the factory y-pipe, I don't need to buy anything to make it street legal, right? Like, I just tell the shop that I want them to cut out the factory system and then they'll weld the new system onto each respective header and it'll be street legal?

Also, are major chains (Midas, Meineke, Car-X) a good place to get this done, or will they just screw it up and then overcharge me?

I've read a lot about cat-back systems. Would these be better than my dual muffler setup, and if so, how?

Finally, is there anything else I should know? What is a good base price for this installation, so I don't get taken to the cleaners?

Thanks for the replies.

[SpectorV]

Since the factory cats are before the factory y-pipe, I don't need to buy anything to make it street legal, right?

They will cut after the last set of cats/resonators so there will not be a problem. It will look like a stock gt cat back minus different mufflers (not oem ford mufflers)

I just tell the shop that I want them to cut out the factory system and then they'll weld the new system onto each respective header and it'll be street legal?

The exhaust from the headers to the back of the cats will not be touched, just the cats back.

Also, are major chains (Midas, Meineke, Car-X) a good place to get this done, or will they just screw it up and then overcharge me?

Most major chains can do it, some give the BS excuse that its close to the fuel lines which its not a problem... I would not pay more than 400 bucks for a full custom catback give or take a bit for stainless tips, which are expensive.

I've read a lot about cat-back systems. Would these be better than my dual muffler setup, and if so, how?


A cat back is a cat back, the only changes are how wide the pipe is, you need 2.25 diameter. Basically its pre bent pipe, couple mufflers, and tips, same as what a shop can do... but... i would only let a shop i know do it. You can always buy a catback take off from a GT mustang (94 - 98 are the best due to their longer tips, not stubby 12 inch tips like the 99 up gt) and just have a shop fab the connection (you can also get a dual exhaust adpator and have it welded in for easy bolt/unbolting of the exhaust (recommended) this will run about 150 for the cat back, 100 for the dual exhaust adaptor, 100 labor, plus mufflers. Sure its more expensive but its better.

Finally, is there anything else I should know? What is a good base price for this installation, so I don't get taken to the cleaners?

300-400 for a custom bent system, around that much for anything, possibly 500 with a dual exhaust adaptor due to they are expensive.

Please ask away for the best info you can get to best decide what to do.

[WhiteStang99]

Personally, I suggest a mom and pop exhaust place. They seem to know more/care more about their work, in my experience.

[AirBrontosaurus]

Alright, I think I'm going to go with dual Flowmaster Super 40's (i really liked the soundclips I heard online), now I just need tips.

Are tips important? Should I just get them at the shop where I get the mufflers, or should I look around online for the best ones. What are the "best" ones? Do they make a real difference in sound, or are they mostly for looks?

[lowflyn]

As far as tips, just be sure, like brandon said, to go with stainless steel tips. As far as major chains, midas treated me right when they welded up my last set of mufflers...they were the only place open that day.

[WhiteStang99]

tips are all about personal preference. I thought I noticed some change when I went from stock GT tips to 3.5 inch tips in the sound, but who knows.

[Seph]

I went for Warlock mufflers, they sounded pretty bad ass and not odd sounding at high tone. Warlocks got a deep nice tone to them.

[SpectorV]

ask the shop if they offer stainless steel tips, if they dont order them online and have them ready to go on the car.

[lowflyn]

Quote: Originally Posted by WhiteStang99 tips are all about personal preference. I thought I noticed some change when I went from stock GT tips to 3.5 inch tips in the sound, but who knows.

I wanna see some pics of these new tips.

[AirBrontosaurus]

Alright, I bought the Flowmaster Super 40s (2 for $140 shipped, can't beat that). When I went muffler-shop shopping, one of the guys had a V6 with those same mufflers on it, and he let me listen to them. Man, they sounded great. Anyways, thanks for all the help, and I'm sure I'll be asking more questions in the near future.

[SpectorV]

definatly ask away not only to us but to the shop as well. The main issues I have found from an exhaust system is:

A) The pipe clears but hits the rear end and rubs the frame perhaps due to improper bending and setting of pipe (to close to things or what not) and if you ever plan to lower your car make SURE they know the rear end will come up 1.5 more inches at least.

B) They do not angle the tips up and they look goofy and pointed down

C) They do not use stainless steel pipe, and it rusts and looks like crap

D) They use chrome tips, sure you can paint the inside of them and they last a bit... but they rust and look like crap very fast

E) The tipes are not symetrical and are off centered. Look at a stock GT

[NorwegianMustang]

I got a X-pipe (with cats) and I like it