cams or nitrous?

[roach]

what would u do, i have enough $$$ left over for either. So far i just bought long tubes,off road x-pipe,cai,75mm tb,and plenum, i think cams would work good with my setup but if anyone has any input please share thanx

[1996stang]

nitrous for big power quick. Cams you will need a tune no matter what.

[roach]

yeah i was gonna get a tune after it was all said and done

[1996stang]

If you want cams i just so happen to have a buddy with a set of comp cams 278's with springs and retainers for $600

[bullitt482]

No point in just getting cams IMO(/\not trying to botch your sale), because you would be getting cams that would help IF you had more flow through the heads. I say after you purchase said cams(see I had a plan /\ ), go and get your heads worked on and/or get a set of reworked heads to take full advantage of the cams.

[bluemustang]

Nitrous FTW

[roach]

so u dont think cams would be worthwhile since i only have long tubes and a 75mm tb, i only have a little over 1 grand left to spend so i dont want to make the wrong choice. thnx for the input so far by the way

[bullitt482]

If you only have a grand to spend, get juice er.... nitrous. There is no way 400 bucks would make the heads worthwhile enough for the cams. Besides, it's much better to setup your cam for the mods you have than to set the mods up for your cam :yup:.

[sweet2kstang]

+1, you will need to get different cams to get full potential out of the power adders. n/a cams will make power but nothing like a set of correct cams will.

[rocknbronco]

Add one more in for the spray

[roach]

appreciate it, probaly will go nitrous.I also read a good article in a muscle mustang mag recently about installing a zex on a 96 4.6, helped me make up my mind

[rocknbronco]

Yeah i have yet to read it but plan on reading it as soon as I can get thru the rest of my "stang porn".

[powerhungry966]

spray! !!! cams should be last! depending on what you'll have in the future, a good cam will gve you some good hp #'s. but again thats after you do more mods to the motor.

[Matthew]

Cams are a big help on these cars, especially above 3000 RPM. One thing about cams, you will always have the power, and you will never risk blowing the motor like you will with nitrous.

Having said that, I'm pretty sure the biggest you can go on a PI headed car without risking a piston to valve clearance issue on the stock short block is the Comp XE262AH. That's a great cam choice though, and one that I run in my 02 with no issues.

As far as head porting is concerned, if you are on a budget, just get out your die grinder and clean them up. The factory heads are actually pretty good, which is one of the reasons why there are no aftermarket castings available yet!

-Matthew

[sweet2kstang]

nitrous doesnt blow motors!!! it is people that dont know anything about nitrous that blows motors! installation, and tune is the 2 biggest things that will make or break a set up. just got to know the limits of the tune, motor, and bottom end.

[bluemustang]

Quote: Originally Posted by Matthew One thing about cams, you will always have the power, and you will never risk blowing the motor like you will with nitrous.

yeah no. obviously if you cheap out on a full nitrous kit your gonna have horrible results but if you get everything you need its as safe as a supercharger.

Get with the times

[Matthew]

You nitrous guys talk big, but wait until your nitrous solenoid sticks open at the top of a run, or your fuel solenoid sticks closed, or you have a weak moment and shift it into overdrive with the juice on to show some corvette what's what on the highway. Then you are in no second chance territory.

If you only run nitrous at the track, and you religiously check everything over each time you go, and you have all the safety equipment, you can make a lot of runs before you use the motor up, but I have seen way too many street cars blown up with nitrous because its exceedingly easy to do something stupid out on the street, and there are no second chances.

As far as being as safe as a supercharger, nothing could be further from the truth. The typical system failure for a supercharger is a broken belt, and this will not blow up your engine. The typical system failure with nitrous is a stuck solenoid, and then its game over.

I stand by my position that with cams you will always have the power, and there is no risk associated with using it.

-Matthew

[bullitt482]

That's no worse than telling a turbo guy, "Just wait for that wastegate to stick." What happens if one of the cams has a bad spot of metal and breaks??? That's like saying just wait on that oil pump to go, just wait on that deer to run out in front of you, just wait on God to strike lightning on your car, so you better not drive it ever.

Please..... ANY, AND I MEAN ANY, modification that you do to your car will have the chance of messing something up. I don't car if it's a dam K & N air filter, there could be some metal mesh in there that was installed incorrectly that could get sucked into the engine and screw it up.


I'm so dam tired of people who KNOW NOT WHAT THEY SPEAK OF, AND TRY TO GIVE ADVICE TO OTHERS ABOUT IT. Regardless of the kind of system/power adder, there is a chance that something that will go wrong. As long as you properly set up your system it can be just as reliable as anything else..... That includes relays, pulling your solenoids and checking for debris every 6 months or so, checking connects, wires, and so on.......

[1996stang]

Quote: Originally Posted by Matthew I stand by my position that with cams you will always have the power, and there is no risk associated with using it. -Matthew

OK there is no risk of hurting anything with cams huh? ok what happens when you do cams and dont get a good tune huh? the same fucking thing that happens with any power adder. If you dont like nitrous dont tell others it will blow your car up.That is the dumbest statement i have ever heard nitrous doesn't kill motor's dumbass people do.

[Matthew]

The fact remains that a nitrous system failure or operator mistake is a game ender, and the risk associated with nitrous systems far exceeds the risk associated with supercharger or turbo systems. The risk associated with a roller cam is essentially nonexistent once the motor passes the startup phase.

I see hundreds and hundreds of Mustangs every year, and the ones that blow up are the ones with nitrous. But hey, go ahead and evangelize nitrous systems all you want for all I care.

-Matthew

[1996stang]

Quote: Originally Posted by Matthew The fact remains that a nitrous system failure or operator mistake is a game ender, and the risk associated with nitrous systems far exceeds the risk associated with supercharger or turbo systems. The risk associated with a roller cam is essentially nonexistent once the motor passes the startup phase. I see hundreds and hundreds of Mustangs every year, and the ones that blow up are the ones with nitrous. But hey, go ahead and evangelize nitrous systems all you want for all I care. -Matthew

THEN SHUT UP AND BUY YOUR VORTECH...... you know that way you can make 380hp 350ftlbs for $4500 and i can make 430hp 550+ftlbs for less than a $1000

[Matthew]

Quote: Originally Posted by 1996stang THEN SHUT UP AND BUY YOUR VORTECH...... you know that way you can make 380hp 350ftlbs for $4500 and i can make 430hp 550+ftlbs for less than a $1000

Well, this thread is supposed to be about a choice between cams or nitrous, not superchargers. Simply being hostile to anyone with a different opinion than yours does, and being completely blind to the merits of choosing cams does not help anyone.

If this car is a 95% street car, cams will make it a lot more fun on an everyday basis than nitrous will. If it's a 95% track car, nitrous will obviously be a more powerful choice. One thing most nitrous guys forget in their accounting though is the cost of bottle fills, which will often exceed $100/weekend in Alberta. Maybe nitrous is free in the southern US ...

-Matthew

[1996stang]

Quote: Originally Posted by Matthew Well, this thread is supposed to be about a choice between cams or nitrous, not superchargers. Simply being hostile to anyone with a different opinion than yours does, and being completely blind to the merits of choosing cams does not help anyone. If this car is a 95% street car, cams will make it a lot more fun on an everyday basis than nitrous will. If it's a 95% track car, nitrous will obviously be a more powerful choice. One thing most nitrous guys forget in their accounting though is the cost of bottle fills, which will often exceed $100/weekend in Alberta. Maybe nitrous is free in the southern US ... -Matthew

Go back to the first page and read what i said then you might realize i didnt say nitrous was the number 1 choice.But you dont realize with cams you need springs and retainers. Ok with that being said you are looking at $1300 for 35hp maybe.That is also before he pays someone $125 an hour or more too tune the car.Also if he cant do the cam install himself he is looking at atlest $600 for cams.He said he had 1000 to spend.

[1996stang]

Quote: Originally Posted by bullitt482 I'm so dam tired of people who KNOW NOT WHAT THEY SPEAK OF, AND TRY TO GIVE ADVICE TO OTHERS ABOUT IT.

This is why i like you

[bluemustang]

I paid 25 bucks per refill

Kinda sucks your paying about double huh

[1996stang]

Quote: Originally Posted by bluemustang I paid 25 bucks per refill Kinda sucks your paying about double huh

yeah must suck too pay 100 for nitrous thats what 10 per pound

[Thomas91169]

Quote: Originally Posted by bullitt482 I'm so dam tired of people who KNOW NOT WHAT THEY SPEAK OF, AND TRY TO GIVE ADVICE TO OTHERS ABOUT IT. Regardless of the kind of system/power adder, there is a chance that something that will go wrong. As long as you properly set up your system it can be just as reliable as anything else..... That includes relays, pulling your solenoids and checking for debris every 6 months or so, checking connects, wires, and so on.......

fuck that, checking solenoids and your connections every sum-odd months is not reliability.

nitrous is nice because its cheap, but its not a full-time mod. its there when you need it and when you know youre going to use it. for me, i dont always know when im going to need to go full throttle, so id rather spend more for power thats there when i need it, not something i have to arm, then unscrew the bottle, make sure all my "uber reliable solenoids" are working right, then spray away.

[roach]

didnt mean to start an argument but thanks for all the input i really appreciate it, i still dont know what im gonna do....wish i had enough for a supercharger but oh well. thanks again-aaron

[1996stang]

Quote: Originally Posted by roach didnt mean to start an argument but thanks for all the input i really appreciate it, i still dont know what im gonna do....wish i had enough for a supercharger but oh well. thanks again-aaron

Just save the money you have now and buy a supercharger when you have enough.My buddy has a vortech v2 sq with 10psi pulley,fuel system,sct flip chip,and basically everything you need to bolt it on and go for $2000

[bullitt482]

Quote: Originally Posted by Matthew The fact remains that a nitrous system failure or operator mistake is a game ender, and the risk associated with nitrous systems far exceeds the risk associated with supercharger or turbo systems. The risk associated with a roller cam is essentially nonexistent once the motor passes the startup phase. I see hundreds and hundreds of Mustangs every year, and the ones that blow up are the ones with nitrous. But hey, go ahead and evangelize nitrous systems all you want for all I care. -Matthew

At least we know when the guy takes his car to the drag strip with cams, and gets beat by a stock fox body with a 100 shot, we will all know who to thank for his wasted thousand bucks

[bullitt482]

Quote: Originally Posted by Thomas91169 **** that, checking solenoids and your connections every sum-odd months is not reliability. nitrous is nice because its cheap, but its not a full-time mod. its there when you need it and when you know youre going to use it. for me, i dont always know when im going to need to go full throttle, so id rather spend more for power thats there when i need it, not something i have to arm, then unscrew the bottle, make sure all my "uber reliable solenoids" are working right, then spray away.

You are totally defeating the purpose his point. He said he had X amount of dollars to spend.... And you are saying to spend more.

The point about checking solenoid and lines is just a precautionary measure. That's no more than saying to check your tire pressure every week or so or checking your oil level. So what you're saying is that if I have to check something then it's not reliable? Well shit, my bicycle is fucking useless then since I check the tires every now and then

And I never knew flipping a switch was so hard to do... If you know you are going to ride around town looking for a random race, take your limp wrist and turn the dam bottle on before you leave. Dammit, do you want something to press the gas pedal down for you also?

[bullitt482]

Quote: Originally Posted by Matthew Well, this thread is supposed to be about a choice between cams or nitrous, not superchargers. Simply being hostile to anyone with a different opinion than yours does, and being completely blind to the merits of choosing cams does not help anyone. If this car is a 95% street car, cams will make it a lot more fun on an everyday basis than nitrous will. If it's a 95% track car, nitrous will obviously be a more powerful choice. One thing most nitrous guys forget in their accounting though is the cost of bottle fills, which will often exceed $100/weekend in Alberta. Maybe nitrous is free in the southern US ... -Matthew

But you are also speaking of guys who run classes, just not for fun and when they feel like it. I seriously doubt that this guy will do more than 3 or 4 passes in a weekend with a 75 or a 100 shot, unlike your buddies whom I bet spray anywhere from a 150-400 shot and run 5 or more times saturday and sunday. Two different ball games.

[Thomas91169]

Quote: Originally Posted by bullitt482 You are totally defeating the purpose his point. He said he had X amount of dollars to spend.... And you are saying to spend more.

no numbnuts, im saying i would rather spend more. "I" being the key here. and im a cheap ass, hell, i have a 91 gsx im modding, cant get much cheaper than that in terms of power gained per dollar spent. i want 400whp for $4k and that includes initial purchase price of the vehicle (900$), and the now $600 its taken to get in running (new head, head gasket, arp studs, exhaust manifold and studs) and reliable condition.

Quote: Originally Posted by bullitt482 And I never knew flipping a switch was so hard to do... If you know you are going to ride around town looking for a random race, take your limp wrist and turn the dam bottle on before you leave. Dammit, do you want something to press the gas pedal down for you also?

not hard, just annoying. i dont know if im going to ride around for random races, thats the point. most the times ive ever went looking for races i fall up short, however leaving my work parking lot i might bump into a evo on the onramp or the like. if i need to pass a car really quick i want all my power when i hit that throttle, not have to arm a switch, hit the throttle, press a button, call nasa, etc.

[Maxion$mulla$]

i think nitrous still messes up motors no matter how its used id go billit cams

[bullitt482]

Please stop speaking about topics you know nothing about... I've said it once and I'll say it again.