Operation: Ruskie Freedom

[MarkuzLS1]

Bloomberg.com: Worldwide

Putin is going to derail the democratic process! Russia is in possession of thousands of WMD's (chem, bio, and nuclear!)! We need to invade and set up a true democracy, for the good of the poor Ruskies who can't do it themselves!

[Brent]

We'd have already invaded China if that was the guidelines.

[n8r]

We just need a cold war 2... Start cleaning out your fall out shelters folks

[Brent]

Our goal with Iraq and Iran is to keep them from becoming a Russia or China so that we don't let some idiot (Putin) get into power with hundreds of Nuclear Weapons.

[MarkuzLS1]

Quit making excuses for the greatest failure in the history of American leadership.

[silverstangboy]

I would hardley compare this to vietnam mark... who was in power then? oh yeah, thats right...

[Brent]

Quote: Originally Posted by MarkuzLS1 Quit making excuses for the greatest failure in the history of American leadership.

Quit trying to make everything about Bush

Just because Bush has made a mess out of Iraq does not mean that ultimately our goal is to keep Iraq and Iran from becoming a Russia or China.

[n8r]

Bush hasn't made this a mess all his own, the entire government has had their hand in screwing up this war.

[Seph]

I blame the government.

[Thomas91169]

Quote: Originally Posted by MarkuzLS1 Quit making excuses for the greatest failure in the history of American leadership.

failure?

we kicked a shit-talking good for nothing dictator out of his own country, primary mission accomplished . the only reason its taken so long for us to get the fuck out of there and establish a government (secondary mission) is not only our military fighting insurgents using crappy tactics, our government is fighting itself, the media is fighting our own country from within, and the rest of the world STILL hasnt done shit to help anyone but themselves and have all backed out because they are pussies.

we still are kicking ass over there. we lose 1, they lose 15. our soldiers signed up to fight, theirs were brainwashed into a false sense of religious duty. Our men and women fight for Freedom, not only ours, but for others; they fight for 72 Virgins, and guess what Ackmed, nobody said anything about them being female.......

sometimes i cant wait for this country/government to utterly fail, so that real leaders can rise from the ashes and re-establish a newly reformed government that is for the people, by the people; re-establish our freedoms and constitutional rights, and turn this country into a world dominating force with a nation behind it 100%, funded and built by 100% american made, a driving force that has not been seen since WWII.

[MarkuzLS1]

You can't win a war against a tactic. That's what terrorism is. A tactic. It allows an entity, militant Islamic fundamentalists in this case, to wage a war against an opponent who has a great advantage in conventional military strength. "The War on Terror" as such, is an unwinnable war.

We could, in theory, win a war against militant Islamic fundamentalists. Since, as you stated, they're "brainwashed into a false sense of religious duty", nothing short of killing them all will end the problem. It's impossible to reason with religious fanatics (be they catholics, baptists, mormons, or muslims). This wouldn't be so bad if there was an islamic fundamentalist nation. A country that we could totally destroy and rebuild as we saw fit (think 1945 Japan). Instead you have an entire region of the globe that is mostly Islamic, and some of them are of the fanatical militant type. It would be like Russia declaring war against conservatives. Yeah, most of them are in the south-east United States, but they are all over the rest of the country, too. Hell, there are probably even some of them in Canada and Mexico. Think about what it would take to wipe out an idea like that. That's the same thing we're up against over there.

The thing that really gets me with Iraq is that we were so much better off with Sadam in power than we are now. Yeah, he was a cruel military dictator and pretty much a terrible person, all around. Yeah, he did terrible things to people in his country and in a couple of others. He was, however, not a fundamentalist islamic radical. That's what we're going to get over there. If we pull out now or in however many years until they've got a viable democracy going. They'll vote in (or somebody will sieze power) that's just like Ahmadinejad, in Iran, or al-Assad, in Syria. The only countries over there that we're pretty much cool with are Pakistan (military dictatorship) and Saudi Arabia (absolute monarchy).

To review, there's no such thing as "The War on Terror", because you can't fight terrorism. It is impossible to defeat militant Islam, you can't ever kill them all. The invasion of Iraq has actually made us worse off than we were before.

[DarkShadow]

I will admit, trying to call this a war on terror was a failure. You can't completely stamp out a belief. We should have learned from history on this with the early christian church, it only fed it and gained more believers.

HOWEVER:

The war in Iraq is NOT A FUCKING FAILURE! Bush told us up front before a troop ever set foot that this would not be over quickly. We were going to be there some time, but the take over was nearly instant. You are always going to have insurgents. This government can be in place for over 100 years and there will still be insurgents led by the same organizations. That is how that region works and EVERY standing government in the middle east has to deal with it. Whether we agree with the government or the insurgents, they exist all over that region.

It's the MF'ing media calling this a failure just like Vietnam. Vietnam was a failure because the government tied the military's hands. Now the CONGRESS is going to start tying the hands of the military AGAIN and force it to failure because it is the "popular" thing to say the war is failing.

America is far from being beaten by a few under equipped rag heads running around blowing themselves up because that is the only way they can get close enough to the people that matter.

America was far from being beaten by local villagers with sticks and guns they barely knew how to use in Vietnam, it was our government not allowing us to exert our full power and put an end to it.

Now because everyone WANTS the war to be a failure, the government is going to go along with it and MAKE it a failure.