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Am I ideological ? You bet I am ! That is why we fell in love with the mustang...otherwise we could all be driving around in subarus.

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Its funny when people say stuff like this because it makes them look like they have no idea on the history behind the mustang. Ford first put a 4 cylinder in the mustang in the second generations back in 1973. Ford never marketed the car as a complete line of all out performance cars. They've always had the base model (which from 1974 through 1994 was a 4 cylinder) and then the 'performance' model which Ford showcased its performance with. Both to appeal to a different crowd of buyers.

And I still don't see how people can love the 14's and hate the 15's. Although there are some differences there are alot of similarities between the two.
 

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Spoken like a true Hypocrite.
That "crappy ass 4 banger" not only puts down GT levels of performance with a tire and tune only
12.6 @ 108 with radial
12.1 @ 112 with slicks
But also makes more power than ANY previous model GT save the S197 5.0 ... I fail to see what about it is crappy other than the fact you're upset it doesn't have 4 more cylinders?


Also, define "not improving." The cars interior is 100x nicer than the outgoing S197, it drives seconds per lap faster around a track, and every 1/4 video I have seen has it matching, or slightly losing (1-2 tenths) to the S197, but without a doubt out trapping it by 1-2 mph as well. Aside from maybe not like the cosmetics, I really do fail to see why everyone hates this car and views it as a failure...

Not trying to argue. But you're saying the evoboost with a tune and tires is running faster then a stock GT 14? Just trying to be clear.


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It evolved for 50 years into different cars, but always with a base attitude...a raw edge. The raw edge is gone...many press reviewers say so as well...and to me, that means bye bye mustang.

2015 is a great sports car...


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Ford did a great job on the new stang. I understand alot of people have their personal gripes about it, the only gripe I agree with is no live axle option. Once a few of them starts getting modded and front grilles start getting upgraded these gripes will disappear. If I knew where to find the write up's from 1998 I would post them. People had the same gripes when the new edge was getting ready for production. (99-04) People where writting to Ford and magazine s about how ugly the cars where and the cobra irs wouldnt be a popular upgrade. The new edge turned out to be one of the most popular body styles. I like my 14 and will keep it until Ford decides to retro the fox body. :D
 

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I am from the original muscle car era. Back then Mustangs/Fords were viewed as under powered dogs. None could hold a candle to my '69 Z28, let alone my '67 SS396 Chevelle with a 427 crate motor. The Tunnel Port Mustang/Boss302 was a joke. I have been hot rodding way longer than most of you have been on this earth. The original muscle car era came to an end in 1971 with lower compression ratios and stricter emission controls. Things have changed. The Mustang is the go to hot rod. The current Camaros are now the dogs. The 5.0 engine is a true jewel of engineering. Light years ahead of my '89 GT.
The future of Mustangs is exciting to me. Flat-plane 5.2 Voodoo = 575+ hp n/a. Wow.
OTOH a Volvo 2.0 prototype engine puts out 450+ hp. Three turbos. One electrically driven.
 

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I just wanted to cruise by and say I DRIVE A [email protected]#%ING MUSTANG!! Carry on with the 70's show. On a side note I did order some Roush Axlebacks and thinking of starting a topic "Is a CAI worth it?"
 

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No, a CAI is NOT worth it. It adds no hp. The stock box is as good as it gets. Don't believe me? Talk to Shaun at AED. He is one of the few people that I have talked with that really understands the basics of drag racing. Power to weight ratio, aerodynamics and traction. Gosh, looks like things have not changed since the '70s show.
 

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They should have definitely offered a live axle as an option.
Do you know how ridiculously small of a population would intentionally buy a live-axle 2015? Absolutely no one except for hardcore drag-racers. Literally no one else. So, how does that make sense as a business decision? Just because someone somewhere might buy something doesn't mean that it should be done. These cars are mass-produced. They aren't bespoke.

Again, it's fine that you guys don't like the looks of the 2015 because it looks too much like a sports car (whatever that means) and it's lost its raw edge (if by "raw edge" you mean outdated axle and suspension and middle ground interior), but for gods sake, you guys go on like a broken record. Day after day, thread after thread. You have nothing productive to say at all. It's always the same crap. "Blah blah blah Fustuaroeuroevoboostaccordastang." You're so clever with your punny nicknames. It's just boring.

If this is what ME has devolved into then I'm out.
 

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After seeing the interior up close and personal I came away with the impression that they took elements from the Fusion and Camaro and incorporated both of them into the car. The seats are very Camaro-esque while the steering wheel and center stack remind me very much of the Fusion loaner we were give for a few months while the wife's car was in the shop. I might grow to like it later, but I am certainly not running out to buy one any time soon.
 

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I bet if we said how much we love it day after day, that would be fine with you. Ford could of easily made the S197 have a more refine interior as you speak of. They didn't need to hold off until the S550. Ford could of easily given the later year S197's IRS. No need to wait for the S550's to give it that.

The Mustang Source Website is complete trash.
No. I like the live axle in my 13.
 

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I love the exterior but once I sat inside the 15 it reminded me too much of a camaro. Hard to see out off so I won't be trading my 14 in for one.
I agree!!!! The car has lost its muscle look and stance! Dont get me wrong, nice car but its a Mustang, not a BMW or a Camaro!!!! Somewhat hate what Ford did with it! :confused:
 

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Voltwings...

First of all hp numbers alone mean jack...I don't care if it puts down 500hp...conceptually, yes ideology and attitude DOES COUNT, a muscle car does not have 4 cylinders. That is a EUROPEAN concept. If I wanted a European car, I would buy one. The mustang is american pride and should stay that way. Aside from conceptually, the problem technically is that you are hauling ass on a 4 banger with a car that weighs like a truck ! Go look at the BMW, Jap cars that run those turbo 4 cyls and look at the weights. You can put down 1000hp crank but if it takes 900 just to get the damn thing moving then you can wipe your feet with it. There will be problems with that engine I guarantee you. Life expectancy will not be long...and this I am getting from the best mustang tuners on the West Coast, I am not pulling it out of my ass.

As for "not improving" I meant the 3.7 v6 engine....which has gone DOWN in hp instead of UP! This is a clear signal they are phasing it out...meaning...in some years if we want to get a new stang, it's either expensive GT or the 4 cylinder...with everything I just said above.

Moreover, I test drove it last week...smooth, quiet, precise, comfortable...those are NOT descriptors of an American muscle car. Ask your grandpa...it felt like an Audi, drove like an Audi and looked like one...

Oh yes, and it sounds like **** as well. Unless you leave on the "fake" engine sound coming through your speakers, yes just as BMW does...see the pattern here ?

Am I ideological ? You bet I am ! That is why we fell in love with the mustang...otherwise we could all be driving around in subarus.


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1. There are several 2.0L turbo cars moving cars that weight 3400-3500 lbs just fine, Evo, Wrx, Golf R ... and Several European cars managing to do the same. Virtually all new BMWs are 2.0L turbos weighing easily mid 3000s. Thats a very narrow minded way of thinking.

2. I'm sorry, you don't want a car that's smooth, precise and comfortable because by definition its not American? I guess someone needs to ring Cadillac about the CTS-v ...

3.. Let me present you with a scenario, and i want an honest answer. Lets assume the base model S550 came with a 3v 4.6L Gt motor, rated at the same 300 hp it was rated at back in the mid 2000s. That engine:
A. Will never make as much torque as the EB
B. Will struggle to make as much Hp, and will require motor works (cams...) to do so
C. Will return less fuel mileage (yes its a mustang, but all else equal, why would you willingly choose the less efficient car?)
D. Id honestly say will not hold as much power on the stock bottom end

but you're still telling me you would have that engine over the Ecoboost because its a v8 and not a 4 cylinder? I'm sorry my friend, but that is the exact definition of Bigotry.


I have done the turbo 4 thing for a long time. Built them, tuned them, worked on them... i've hurt a lot of V8 feelings in my day. I've also gotten beat plenty of times too, i dont claim the EB4 to be better than the 5.0. Hell, i sold my last turbo 4 because i wanted a V8, i LOVE big all motor power. I do find it increasingly irritating however that people continue to ignorantly and absent mindedly bash this fantastic engine. I think a lot of people could stand to broaden their horizons from "mustang" fans to "performance" fans. I am probably the #1 mustang fan, i love them, have always loved them, and will likely always own one. I can however, respect performance in any guise, and i would expect the same from others.
 

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1. and I owned those cars back in Europe. I'm from there...VW Corrado g60, BMW m3...guess what ? At 100,000km (not miles !) it was a nightmare. And we in Europe generally have the perception that a car at 100k mileage is dead. See the pattern ?

2. Euro mustang clubs are hating the 2015 as well...because it's TOO EURO...and they want American. That means attitude, that means loud, that means having to fight the car a little but that is what makes it fun, personable and passionate...not a cold satellite driven robotic synthetic feel of a car like the 2015 is or like pretty much any BMW...maybe you like your women like manikins...I like them with personality. Guess what ? I LOVE my rear live suspension on my 2014...would never trade it for IRS. Why ? It feels alive, it feels raw, it feels edgy...I know how to handle it and have fun doing so.

3. B and C...but the issue is...do not abandon the 3.7 V6 which has a lot of potential in favor of the ecoBoost. Want the ecoBoost for your radical chic, somewhat Prius driving, environmentally friendly European immigrants ? Great...but do not phase out the V6 and force everyone to make a hard choice, especially when that is the engine you have been selling the most of. As for the Eco...I would never buy a muscle car with that philosophy of an engine...sorry, call me bigot if you want, but I'm proud of it. I fell in love with American muscle cars, not euro wannabes. I'll probably move to the Challenger after my 2014 is set to go.

I did the 4 turbo for decades too...back in Europe. As I said, as you said...in the end we marry the bigger engines and the more American attitude...otherwise as I said, why even bother buying mustang ? Get a Nissan, a Subaru WrX or a Lexus...
Time will tell on this engine...but what I am getting from top mustang tuners, is the engine is fine, but not on that size and weight of a car.


And by the way...the 2015 absolutely looks like a fusion.


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Do you know how ridiculously small of a population would intentionally buy a live-axle 2015? Absolutely no one except for hardcore drag-racers. Literally no one else. So, how does that make sense as a business decision? Just because someone somewhere might buy something doesn't mean that it should be done. These cars are mass-produced. They aren't bespoke.

Again, it's fine that you guys don't like the looks of the 2015 because it looks too much like a sports car (whatever that means) and it's lost its raw edge (if by "raw edge" you mean outdated axle and suspension and middle ground interior), but for gods sake, you guys go on like a broken record. Day after day, thread after thread. You have nothing productive to say at all. It's always the same crap. "Blah blah blah Fustuaroeuroevoboostaccordastang." You're so clever with your punny nicknames. It's just boring.

If this is what ME has devolved into then I'm out.
So its alright to force feed your opinions but shoot down others? You're a part of the problem you claim to be sick of.
People will always have something to say. If you don't like the broken record then don't click on the thread or unsubscribe. Its really that simple. Also you couldn't be more wrong about the small amount of people wanting the live axle. I would like the 15 that much more if it had a live rear axle and I know for a fact I'm not alone. Ford was bullied into changing by everyone saying its outdated and needs to be more modern. More modern for what! The millions of track day enthusiasts that want that extra shaved second around Laguna seca? I don't think so. I have never met ANYONE who actually takes their DD mustangs to track days. I've met hundreds of people like myself that prefer a live rear axle. I know there are track guys out there but the average Joe mustang buys the car to have fun and you can have fun with a "ancient" rear suspension like 99% of mustangs have.

So when are you trading your old outdated hunk of metal for the latest and greatest thing that's ever happened in the history of ever?
 
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